Cultural acceptance of bestiality is inevitable

[Tailo]

We don't need to allow them access to anything pornographic or erotic, and we don't need to give them how-to advice or engage in any sexually focused discussion with them, those things can be made against the rules and members who are younger than 18 can be restricted access to the more sexual parts of the site.

I think that how-tos which do not encourage sex, but show how to do it as safe as possible when you are going to do it anyway, can be valuable for a person independent of the person's age.

Imagine we would deny young people who are into their own species information about contraceptives and protection against sexual transmittable deseases until they are 18 years old. That would not be good, would it?

 

[SigmaTheZeta]

@Tailo what you are saying is similar to the point that some states in the USA tried denying teenagers access to condoms, and they ended up with a teen pregnancy crisis that everyone told them they were asking for.

A similar problem has been observed in states that have attempted to suppress comprehensive sex education: they did not want to teach kids about safe sex, so the kids got a lot of information instead about unsafe bareback gritty BDSM dungeon worship my dripping panties worthless slave sexuality and thereby got a lot of serious diseases and unwanted pregnancies. By denying them information about how to do it safely, the legislators in those states created a problem they could have resolved by simply pouring gasoline over their heads and setting themselves on fire and thereby keeping themselves out of it.

Sorry for the piqued language, but scientists, teachers, and everyone with any brains has been pushing here for comprehensive sex ed for years, but anytime we try, the opponents to into a shrieking panic and hysterically babble a lot of discredited nonsense or even outright mumbo-jumbo. The politics surrounding it are very toxic.

 

[Pillar]

@Tailo what you are saying is similar to the point that some states in the USA tried denying teenagers access to condoms, and they ended up with a teen pregnancy crisis that everyone told them they were asking for.

A similar problem has been observed in states that have attempted to suppress comprehensive sex education: they did not want to teach kids about safe sex, so the kids got a lot of information instead about unsafe bareback gritty BDSM dungeon worship my dripping panties worthless slave sexuality and thereby got a lot of serious diseases and unwanted pregnancies. By denying them information about how to do it safely, the legislators in those states created a problem they could have resolved by simply pouring gasoline over their heads and setting themselves on fire and thereby keeping themselves out of it.

Sorry for the piqued language, but scientists, teachers, and everyone with any brains has been pushing here for comprehensive sex ed for years, but anytime we try, the opponents to into a shrieking panic and hysterically babble a lot of discredited nonsense or even outright mumbo-jumbo. The politics surrounding it are very toxic.

I think that sex education was looked at by the "moralists" as a "gateway" to "deviancy". In other words, if you don't tell them about sex, they won't think about it or do it. Because pretending that teenagers won't have sex works every time. Now to bury some more heads in the sand... *Rolls eyes*

 

[caikgoch]

I think that sex education was looked at by the "moralists" as a "gateway" to "deviancy". In other words, if you don't tell them about sex, they won't think about it or do it. Because pretending that teenagers won't have sex works every time. Now to bury some more heads in the sand... *Rolls eyes*

They'll never figure out how to fire a gun or steal a car either.

 

[SpaceDragon]

@ZTHorse has been pushing for getting funding into research for quite a long time. If you want, then you can help me go through some of these articles and find information about the research, including what agencies funded it and everyone else that was behind it. The acknowledgements sections of research papers tend to have very important information about how the work actually got from the idea stage to the laboratory.

Of the 8 other "Zoo and Research Data" articles, only 2 of them had an acknowledgements section:

Beetz & Podberscek (Eds.). (2005). Bestiality and zoophilia: Sexual relations with animals
ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS
We thank the RSPCA for financial support for the study, the Scottish SPCA for support and interest, and the BSAVA for the provision of members’address labels. Special thanks are also due to Dave Stone and Rhona Muirhead of Edinburgh University for their invaluable help with the study’s database. Finally, we are most grateful indeed to the veterinarians who completed and returned questionnaires.

Understanding Bestiality and Zoophilia By Hani Miletski Ph.D - 2002
ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS
I could not have written this book without the help and support of many: “Chris,” my client, was my inspiration for the study on bestiality and zoophilia. The late Mark Matthews wrote The Horseman which really touched me. “Beverly,” Remus, “Jim,” “Ted,” and Stasya opened the door for me to the zoo (short for zoophiles) community, persuaded their zoo-friends to participate in the study, and gave me advice. The participants in the two Focus Groups which I facilitated in order to gather ideas about what to ask in the questionnaire. All the zoos who have contacted me with their warm words, encouraging and thanking me for doing the study and writing the book. And most of all, the individuals who took the time to fill-out 23 pages of 350 questions about their most intimate (and often secretive) issues. This book is dedicated to all of you. As I was doing the study and writing my doctoral dissertation, I had the three best committee members I could have wished for: Jerry Zientara, Ed.D., Judy Seifer, R.N., Ph.D., and Robert Phillips, Jr., Ph.D.. They were always there for me, reading, over and over again, my long chapters. They encouraged me, gave me words of advice, and even helped me find rare literature. My fellow colleagues from the Institute for Advanced Study of Human Sexuality, Raffaele Donofrio, Ed.D., Ralph Bruno, M.A., and Robert Lawrence, Ph.D., provided guidance and helped me gather data about different aspects of zoophilia and bestiality. And the Editor of The Wild Animal Revue lent me several rare books and ran my ad in the magazine without asking anything in return. My friends and colleagues, Annette Owens, M.D., Ph.D. and Cathleen Glass, M.S.W. read the manuscript and provided me with invaluable comments and suggestions on how to make the book better. And my loving husband, Arthur Goldberg, encouraged and supported me while helping edit this endless manuscript. I thank all of you from the bottom of my heart.

 

[SpaceDragon]

Here's a video that was made also, maybe you can find some info I missed.

Defining Zoophilia with Andrea Beetz - Welcome to Animals & Society Institute | Ann Arbor Michigan

This week’s Defining HAS video series video is by Andrea Beetz, Researcher and Teacher in the Department of Special Education, University of Rostock, who has defined the term zoophilia. Andrea M. Beetz, psychologist, Ph.D. is a researcher and teacher at the University of Rostock, Germany...

www.animalsandsociety.org

 

[SpaceDragon]

So uh... what do we have to do to get these groups to do more studies?

 

[SigmaTheZeta]

So uh... what do we have to do to get these groups to do more studies?

Well, it is a little bit more complicated to find a researcher that we can get interested in our situation, but this proves, at least, the point that there is a precedent for grant-funded studies examining zoos in-depth. It is very hard, though, to get a scientist on our side. It is not that they are otherwise against you, but they tend to seldom be strongly FOR anybody, either. This gives us a case that grant-funded research has already happened.

There is one that is in the furry community that I am going to start reaching out to. He is not an anti-zoo as far as I know.

 

[Wolfia]

Cultural acceptance is overrated. Why can't i have my own little knotty fun time to myself? Moreover, people i know are full aware that I love canines. They just dont know i have sex with them lol. Why would i announce it? People are either going to be disgusted or they're going to stalk me.

I'm perfectly fine with inflatable doggie dildos and horse cock dildos on etsy and other online retailers. Once Spencer's starts selling them then you can praise cultural acceptance

 

[420Fatty]

Once Spencer's starts selling them then you can praise cultural acceptance

Imagine if selling dog and horse dildos made Spencer's blow up into more than just a mall oddity.

 

[Wolf2]

You should be able to tell by the animal's behaviors and body language. If a bitch (female dog) is happily panting and pushing your cock into her pussy it's a safe bet she wants it. Same with mares.

Correct me if I am wrong but I believe Germany has bestiality legal while keeping zoosadism/animal abuse illegal. Basically you can have sex with your animals as long as they are consensual and willing participants to it.

I’m not sure, I think they made it illegal entirely, but the punishment is not severe.

I'm not at all scared of religious fundamentalists, people nowadays know that "because god" is a pretty dumb argument.

When it comes to convincing people that dogs and other animals can feel pleasure and can consent, there are already some studies done on that showing they can, but we need more, and I think we need to rely on sexologists and animal behaviorists to make these arguments because they can do so with credibility in a professional, non-creepy manner and with evidence to back it up. We need to come together as a community and fund these kinds of studies into animal pleasure, sexual behavior, cognizance and consent, and even studies into how an animal can have sex with a human safely, pleasurably, and consensually through demonstration, and once they are done we need to circulate them around where ever we can. When we do this, we can show people with evidence that human/animal sex is not as abusive and non-consensual as they thought.

I’m not sure if you’ve noticed the current American strain of dominant politicians and their willingness to sell the country to Christian dominionism. That form of Christianity (most Christianity) has no tolerance for anything except one married man and one woman.

 

[SpaceDragon]

I’m not sure if you’ve noticed the current American strain of dominant politicians and their willingness to sell the country to Christian dominionism. That form of Christianity (most Christianity) has no tolerance for anything except one married man and one woman.

That type of christian fundamentalism in government at this point is a very small minority, and their popularity is going down not up. Nowadays if you were to argue against things like homosexuality (especially on religious grounds) people would come at you with pitchforks and torches. There's really not any argument people can make about controlling people's lives from a religious standpoint today without being heavily scrutinized by the public.

Of all the arguments I hear from anti-zoos about why human/animal sex is wrong, definitely the least common among them is the "because it goes against the bible" argument. If we want to change people's minds about human/animal sex, we really do not need to even address religion because almost no one argues against it on religious grounds.

 

[Aluzky]

Unfortunately the only “zoos” who get any exposure are zoosadists

They are not zoos, they have nothing to do with our community. So stop trying to make people think that zoosadists and zoos are the same or similar.

that babbling retard known as Aluzky who single handedly ruined the zoo community on Reddit

I have an IQ of 134, only 2% of the human population score that high. You calling me a retard only shows who has a tiny IQ in here, you would be unable to beat me in anything that requires intelligence, even if your life depended on it.

Also, reddit banned the zoo community there, but it didn't ruin it, it just got moved to other places like here.
You can't blame me for what reddit does, I wasn't the only zoosexual on that site.

and Whitney Wisconsin who isn’t even a zoo(and started making videos again) but quite a few zoos were quick to rally to her defense.

United we stand, divided we fall. This community has his big share of bestialists, she is a bestialist. Just like I defend zoosexuals who do no harm to animals, I will defend bestialists that do no harm to animals. And before you say that she killed a puppy. That was a stunt to get attention, no puppy was killed. She took pictures of a puppy sleeping and made up a story that she had accidentally killed the puppy. She is a cam whore (compliment) the more attention she gets, the more money she makes, that puppy stunt got her thousands of dollars because that went viral, millions of people saw the story and a few looked her up and stay on her website to pay for her porn. So get your facts straight.

So if anyone is wondering why we’re saying we won’t get exposure or rights, this shit right here is why.

The world trend leans toward giving humans their deserved human rights. Zoosexuals are humans, we deserve human rights. Same way gays are humans and they got their human rights. Also, websites and media is becoming more fluid, more commoners get to mingle with zoosexuals, we are getting more exposure than what we got in the 1990s. And that exposure should go up and up.

People can now easily seek zoosexual porn that shows cosnensual non-abusive zoosex is REAL, dispelling the myth that all zoosex is abusive and non-consensual by default.

 

[Pillar]

Cultural acceptance is overrated. Why can't i have my own little knotty fun time to myself? Moreover, people i know are full aware that I love canines. They just dont know i have sex with them lol. Why would i announce it? People are either going to be disgusted or they're going to stalk me.

I'm perfectly fine with inflatable doggie dildos and horse cock dildos on etsy and other online retailers. Once Spencer's starts selling them then you can praise cultural acceptance

You are very right, you don't need their acceptance/approval for your activities. But there are a handful* of people who have been outed and forced into jail for their animal love, which is wrong. This is why culture as a whole ought to be accepting of it - in the case someone gets outed as a zoo, their lives won't be ruined for it.

*Edited for a more appropriate statement.

 

[BlueBeard]

You are very right, you don't need their acceptance/approval for your activities. But there are plenty of people who have been outed and forced into jail for their animal love, which is wrong. This is why culture as a whole ought to be accepting of it - in the case someone gets outed as a zoo, their lives won't be ruined for it.

Totally agree with the sentiment. Just want to correct a couple things:

1. There are *not* a lot of people who've been outed and forced into jail for it. Very low percentage. Incredibly low percentage.

2. But when the few people who do, do get publicity? Holy shit!!! That's scary as fuck. The blood lust behind the witch hunt scares me to the core. I know that there are people who might be copy/pasting what I write, even in this sanctuary, to a YouTube post soliciting people to locate me, find me, kill me. Notice that I've taken my avatar down, erased my profile details, gone through my postings and responses and erased things that could be used to identify me. I did that after seeing what happened to another Zooville member here. Scares the fuck out of me.

But in spite of that, no. Cultural acceptance, to me? -- Neither here nor there. I just see it coming. Not in 2020. But it's coming. People who get outed and persecuted and "ruined" -- they gave too much too soon that could be used against them. Damn it all to hell.

 

[Wolf2]

They are not zoos, they have nothing to do with our community. So stop trying to make people think that zoosadists and zoos are the same or similar.



I have an IQ of 134, only 2% of the human population score that high. You calling me a retard only shows who has a tiny IQ in here, you would be unable to beat me in anything that requires intelligence, even if your life depended on it.

Also, reddit banned the zoo community there, but it didn't ruin it, it just got moved to other places like here.
You can't blame me for what reddit does, I wasn't the only zoosexual on that site.




United we stand, divided we fall. This community has his big share of bestialists, she is a bestialist. Just like I defend zoosexuals who do no harm to animals, I will defend bestialists that do no harm to animals. And before you say that she killed a puppy. That was a stunt to get attention, no puppy was killed. She took pictures of a puppy sleeping and made up a story that she had accidentally killed the puppy. She is a cam whore (compliment) the attention she gets the more money she makes, that puppy stunt got her thousands of dollars, because that went viral, millions of people saw the story and a few looked her up and stay on her website to pay for her porn. So get your facts straight.



The world trend leans toward giving humans their deserved human rights. Zoosexuals are humans, we deserve human rights. Same way gays are humans and they got their human rights. Also, websites and media is becoming more fluid, more commoners get to mingle with zoosexuals, we are getting more exposure than what we got in the 1990s. And that exposure should go up and up.

I don’t know you too well, but I would like to point out that pointing out your IQ usually backfires, even if it’s true. Reveal your IQ by engaging the content’s central argument or indicating the logical fallacy, for example.

 

[SpaceDragon]

Totally agree with the sentiment. Just want to correct a couple things:

1. There are *not* a lot of people who've been outed and forced into jail for it. Very low percentage. Incredibly low percentage.

2. But when the few people who do, do get publicity? Holy shit!!! That's scary as fuck. The blood lust behind the witch hunt scares me to the core. I know that there are people who might be copy/pasting what I write, even in this sanctuary, to a YouTube post soliciting people to locate me, find me, kill me. Notice that I've taken my avatar down, erased my profile details, gone through my postings and responses and erased things that could be used to identify me. I did that after seeing what happened to another Zooville member here. Scares the fuck out of me.

But in spite of that, no. Cultural acceptance, to me? -- Neither here nor there. I just see it coming. Not in 2020. But it's coming. People who get outed and persecuted and "ruined" -- they gave too much too soon that could be used against them. Damn it all to hell.

I think that even if there are only a few zoos who get outed and jailed we should do everything we can to prevent that from happening again, and even liberate (legally) those who have been jailed wrongly. We need to make sure that those who would get punished or harassed or spied on (especially by authorities) due to evidence free accusations have a competent legal defense to protect their constitutional right to due process, privacy, and protection from unreasonable search and seizure. We need to also defend those who are caught having non-violent, non-forceful sex with an animal and have not committed any violent crime by explaining to a judge that the crime they have committed is a victimless crime and that they are not a violent person. Most importantly however, we need to remember that just because most of us do not get outed or caught does not mean that those who do are somehow deserving of their fate. Like it or not, we are all humans, and humans are flawed creatures who make mistakes. It is important for us to not turn our backs on those who are innocent but happen to have a stroke of bad luck, and even though you might not think it likely, any one of us could make a mistake that lands us in a similarly horrible situation, and then we would be the ones desperate for help.

 

[SigmaTheZeta]

I don’t know you too well, but I would like to point out that pointing out your IQ usually backfires, even if it’s true. Reveal your IQ by engaging the content’s central argument or indicating the logical fallacy, for example.

I would also point out that it usually backfires to insult someone's intelligence just because they have strong opinions you disagree with. Highly gifted people can also be opinionated headstrong problematic little shits, and we therefore get called idiots substantially more often than actual idiots.

My school did not like me because I dealt with getting grabbed by teachers thusly. I bit one of them and then kicked him several times in the shins. I hit another one in his temple with a desk. I threw a computer at another and hit him in his solar plexus. I had also gotten my father to quit beating me with a belt by kicking him in the head hard enough to give him a serious concussion and then tore out a bloody chunk of my mother's hair for good measure. I had a strong belief that it was perfectly valid for me to act in my own self-defense, and if adults that would not recognize this thereby got traumatic brain injury as a result, I believed that this was their problem and not really mine.

I and the adults in my life therefore were in a state of disagreement about whether or not I should have a right to act in my own self-defense against misdemeanor assault and battery, and since I disagreed with them, they felt it was therefore self-evident that administering an IQ test was a little bit of red tape they needed to get through to have me put into the same classrooms as other children that were less intelligent than others. As it turned out, I was gifted.

Once in a while, highly intelligent people can simply disagree with you, even when you actually are correct, so I would sternly caution against ever assuming that a person that disagrees with you, even when you actually are correct, is inherently a moron.

One of the most important wisdoms I have ever learned is that, sometimes, somebody just disagrees with you, and I would have you know that the words "I disagree" have a quality about them that means a lot more than mere intelligence. They contain wisdom, which is really far more useful, in the long run, than intelligence alone. My belief is that everyone ought to learn how to use those words. I have found them to be immensely powerful.

 

[Aluzky]

1. There are *not* a lot of people who've been outed and forced into jail for it. Very low percentage. Incredibly low percentage.

@BlueBeard
Thousands of people being outed and or jailed for bestiality related acts, while being a low porcentage of the population, it is still A LOT of people. So you corrected nothing.


▬▬▬▬.Reply to some one else.▬▬▬▬

I would like to point out that pointing out your IQ usually backfires, even if it’s true.

@Wolf2
My personal mission for life: Non-factual claims must always be corrected with facts.

I don't mind if it backfires, I stay true to my personal mission.

 

[SpaceDragon]

So what does anyone think of the idea of starting a sort of fundraiser to provide legal defense to zoos who might need it?

 

[Tailo]

So what does anyone think of the idea of starting a sort of fundraiser to provide legal defense to zoos who might need it?

National or international? An official, transparent organization or a piggy bank in someone's kitchen who would prefer to stay anonymous?

 

[Aluzky]

So what does anyone think of the idea of starting a sort of fundraiser to provide legal defense to zoos who might need it?

I'm totally in favor. A charity of sort should be funded with actual workers and all. An intentional one, not anonymous.

 

[SpaceDragon]

National since I don't know anything about other countries' legal systems (it probably can be expanded though). It can be transparent if it's not specifically made for zoos (maybe even if it is idk), but rather made for anyone who are victims of the kinds of things zoos are made victims of, like violations of due process and privacy rights.

 

[SigmaTheZeta]

@Tailo @SpaceDragon

Something I think is more realistic would be for zoos that choose to associate together, such as for the sake of activism and public advocacy, start setting aside savings accounts specifically for helping each other overcome legal complications.

I think it may be possible to make a joint account into a living trust with a trustee that is bound by a secret but legally enforceable contract. I am pretty sure that terms for a trustee that the trustee is obligated to follow can be held secret, only accessible by a court-ordered subpoena to access them and to bring them before the court, and otherwise, there is no need for the trustee to tell anybody what the actual terms of the trust are. Therefore, only the trustee and beneficiaries would need to know the terms of the trust.

A cunning lawyer could sort out how that would work.

Set up rules with their banks requiring that a certain percentage of their incomes go into that trust as a sort of legal insurance policy.

I am pretty sure that, once someone had created a prototype, others would start using it. It would just be a matter of a group of advocates realizing that they can afford to take greater risks, such as trying to get on The View or on The Late Show, if they have a dedicated trust for helping ward off external threats.

I am betting that a cunning lawyer could figure it out. I don't know the law anywhere near well enough to know how it would work, but I think that if we had even one zoo or zooey ally that was a cunning lawyer, it could be worked out.

It would work basically like an insurance policy, I think.

 

[SpaceDragon]

@Tailo @SpaceDragon

Something I think is more realistic would be for zoos that choose to associate together, such as for the sake of activism and public advocacy, start setting aside savings accounts specifically for helping each other overcome legal complications.

I think it may be possible to make a joint account into a living trust with a trustee that is bound by a secret but legally enforceable contract. I am pretty sure that terms for a trustee that the trustee is obligated to follow can be held secret, only accessible by a court-ordered subpoena to access them and to bring them before the court, and otherwise, there is no need for the trustee to tell anybody what the actual terms of the trust are. Therefore, only the trustee and beneficiaries would need to know the terms of the trust.

A cunning lawyer could sort out how that would work.

Set up rules with their banks requiring that a certain percentage of their incomes go into that trust as a sort of legal insurance policy.

I am pretty sure that, once someone had created a prototype, others would start using it. It would just be a matter of a group of advocates realizing that they can afford to take greater risks, such as trying to get on The View or on The Late Show, if they have a dedicated trust for helping ward off external threats.

I am betting that a cunning lawyer could figure it out. I don't know the law anywhere near well enough to know how it would work, but I think that if we had even one zoo or zooey ally that was a cunning lawyer, it could be worked out.

It would work basically like an insurance policy, I think.

So how would we find such a lawyer?

 

[SigmaTheZeta]

@SpaceDragon That is what building up the zooey community and improving communications with other zoos and zooey allies is for. This is why you hang out on forums like this one, make friends, volunteer to help with advocacy projects like Zooier Than Thou, stick your neck out enough to actually meet people in your area for some reason besides getting animal sex, and in general stay involved. All this community building is about trying to find people who can put their resources together in a productive way.

Or wait, I have an even better idea, a combination insurance policy and credit union or a credit union that also acts like an insurance policy. The credit union would have authorization to use its resources for the legal defense of members of the credit union, just as long as the reasons why that person is being incarcerated go directly against the stated values of the credit union as agreed upon by the current board.

It would otherwise act like a bank account, though, and it would build up interest just like any other bank account. You could get a mutual fund with it, and it would grow just like any other mutual fund.

The difference would be that, in the rare circumstance that a person were busted for having sex with his or her dog or horse, the money would be there to fund that person's legal defense up to a certain cap determined by the current board as being a reasonable financial burden.

 

[SigmaTheZeta]

I mean, @SpaceDragon, maybe you will feel disappointed early on that, most of the time, people that want to talk to you are 19 year old CHILDREN that are primarily focused on trying to beg you for a chance to fuck your dog, and I am sure that many owners here might find that to be frustrating, but being young is not a permanent condition. Eventually, one of them--out of the hundreds that you befriend--will get his shit together enough to pursue a law degree, and having known you and other zoos in the community for a long time and been given a lot of moral support by the community, that person might choose to use his resources to discreetly help the community. Young people that are horny, lonely, and sometimes panicky instinctively reach out for community. If you are patient with them and give them a chance to grow as people, I think that, over time, we can build up a healthy community of mature adults who have learned to care about the wider zooey community. Building up a community takes time, and patience and dedication are key.

 

[caikgoch]

First, the organization would have to be national because different nations have different rules.

In the US you want to form a 501c3 corporation. The simplest way would be with an all volunteer staff thereby skipping most IRS reporting requirements. The stated charity would be education. Everyone involved would be identified and legally responsible.

The only other way is cash in cookie jar somewhere.

 

[SigmaTheZeta]

@caikgoch, I thought my idea for a credit union was pretty ingenious. As barely enforceable as these bullshit laws are, the costs involved in helping with court cases the board is prepared to pursue would be trivial.

 

[SigmaTheZeta]

America’s First LGBT-Focused Credit Union To Launch In 2020

Michigan approved a charter for the first credit union in America designed to serve and advocate for LGBTQ customers across the country.

www.forbes.com

It would have to get through the process of the charter being approved, but once the charter was approved, I think it would be an important milestone for us if such a credit union could get established. We would need enough zoos that collectively have the kinds of resources that would be needed in order to start one and lobby to get the charter through, and that is where building up the community comes in. It takes a lot of resources to get a credit union off the ground. Once started, a credit union can be a very powerful financial institution.