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Married but alone in this ... you too?

Wes_Wylde said:
I'm a married male of one year, but have been living in a largely monogamous relationship with my wife for eight years and would love to be included in whatever support structures are developed here, because I am in the same boat.

I've been thinking about this and working at it for years, so I wrote a huge post here disecting my situation and plan to try to work toward a zoo relationship from a hard no. Sorry for writing what feels like the longest comment in Zooville history, but I hope this may help others get where they want to go eventually, and I hope that it spurs others to think of other proactive solutions to this very specific type of relationship impasse, and I'm eager to read others' thoughts on zooifying relationships.

I agree with one of the other commentors (though in less harsh terms, because I appreciate the difficulty of being a zoo person living in an anti-zoo relationship with someone you probably otherwise love and cherish): if you have to repress and conceal part of yourself, and if there's no way to compromise on a safe container for these feelings, then you need to end that relationship for both your good.

You can set a boundary surrounding your zoo identity and place in the zoo community any time, but you must be firm and consistent once you decide to go for it. I sold myself out early in my relationship because when she moved in with me she was still seriously talking to three other guys, one of whom I feared had more in common with her and could take her from me. I was so lonely that I agreed to become monogamous to get those guys out of the picture at the cost of my ability to have a four-legged lover. It was a terrible mistake made out of fear and desparation not to be alone again and to keep around this fabulous person I'd just met; but I have been able to roll it back over years of regular small pushes when it naturally comes up.

You need to look at the unique circumstances of your particular relationship and your spouse's personal history. For example, there are several factors in why my wife doesn't want a zoo-friendly relationship: 1. Her greatest aspiration is to be a foster parent, and she's rightly worried that if I am active that might result in legal trouble that would hinder our ability to do foster care. 2. She's got childhood trauma from sexual abuse that makes engaging in sex hard for her a lot of the time, especially outside the norm stuff. 3. She grew up in an extremely conservative Christian household that was very sex negative (her sister would take baths in her bathing suit when she was still a teen living at home, if that gives you the slightest idea how buttoned up their family is). 4. She's a BBW and has a lot of body dysmorphia and is perpetually insecure that she's not going to be able to keep me or that anyone else would be attracted to her. 5. She's diagnosed with Borderline Personality Disorder, PTSD, Bipolar II, and the usual crew of major depression, generalized anxiety, etc. One of the big characteristics of Borderline is inflexibility in moral judgments and evaluations of people: the world is black and white, no shades of grey. She's really come a long way with all of this through SSRIs, dialectical behavioral therapy (DBT), and sparse and assisted use of psychedelics; but that doesn't mean any of that stuff completely goes away, just that it's managed. 6. She'll be jealous that another being might get more of my attention, since I'm far more sexual than her. 7. I was an alcoholic for several years and gradually lied more and more to cover up and support my use. We've done a lot of healing, but some level of damaged trust is permanent because you'll always remember that your spouse let you down and was massively selfish for a period of years.

I was active in zoo as a teen and have not been in adulthood because she moved in with me and forbade it before I got a dog of my own. She informally banned me from watching porn of any sort, but especially zoo porn, by constantly getting extremely upset and melting down when I did. She thought it was dirty, degrading, and immoral. This went on for years, and I told myself that all relationships take sacrifice and this was mine. Because she's a very caring, attentive partner who is my best friend and always strives for the best for and in me, I was willing to try to give up a core part of who I am.

But as someone else said, you cannot suppress who you are. It comes back 10x as strong when you try. I tried for years to think if I stopped watching, stopped engaging with the community, then I'd forget and no longer desire it. I was so wrong. The longer away the more I obsessed over it, the more exciting sneaking away to jerk off to it was, which made me want to sneak and do it for real behind her back. This and my alcoholism made me draw back from her, hiding myself more, which was just me robbing myself of the joy of being around the person I love. The alcoholism also came from all the resentment I had over feeling controlled and my inability to communicate and problem solve with her. What really helped me the most was Marshall Marshall Rosenberg's Nonviolent Communication (you can download that or any other book I mention for free at z-lib.org)

Tl;dr Nonviolent communication has four main components:
  1. Express the concrete actions we observe that are affecting our well-being or that of others we’ve been appointed to speak for.
  2. Gently tell the person how we feel about what we observe.
  3. Connect this to the needs and desires we have.
  4. Request concrete actions that will enrich our lives and those around us.
It's best to communicate your needs and be honest. Lies generally catch up with you at some point, and the more you lie the sooner it's going to happen. One day you're going to get claw marks that are hard to explain, your spouse will find a damning text or video of you getting bred, walk in on you deeply knotted, or maybe you end up with severe rectal bleeding that you will struggle to explain as you ask to go to the hospital.

I got tired of feeling like I was walking on eggshells to do one of the things I enjoy most. I was hiding my masturbation and porn like a preteen at church camp. One day when my wife got mad about walking in on me jerking it to my phone, instead of apologizing and surrendering as I always did out of fear of conflict, I got brave and laid down my law: I've been into this for over a decade before I met you, it's part of who I am, I can't deny it, have never successfully stopped becayse it satisfies a deep emotional need for me, and you won't engage these desires, so I need an outlet and the porn will do to keep me from actively seeking a canine partner.

We've both accepted this imperfect balance. It makes her more secure to know that I won't act on my desires, but videos are a shallow substitute for a real K9 romance. And that's the art of compromise: everyone's a little unhappy with respect to what they want, but everyone gets what they need.

I don't have any silver bullets, but I do have some advice and ideas for swaying your partner. Start by accepting your spouse's boundaries, and come to peace with the fact that your significant other may never change their mind on this topic. There's a lot of cultural conditioning that goes on surrounding taboo topics, both moral principles derrived from religion and philosophy, as well as a common sense understanding that violating a taboo comes with a real material cost (usually social and/or exclusion).

I really noticed social conditioning related to non-human intimacy after years of getting accustomed to my wife telling our teacup Maltese to stop licking herself to avoid getting hot spots, my wife telling our dog to stop licking my wife's feet and other parts that she's sensitive about, and my fear of her suspecting anything erotic between me and the pets. Through all these social norms we'd established I started picking up the inherent taboo that dog licking is dirty and bad, and I would recoil like "eww gross!" when our dog licked me more than a few times. Then one day as she was licking me and I was about to fuss at her I remebered: "Oh wait, I actually like this feeling, I don't need to stop her!" It was like re-unlocking the joy of the immediate experience instead of being focused on some abstract notion of cleanliness. I started giving the dog her medicine in peanut butter on my finger so I could enjoy the licks without my partner being distressed about it. That taught me it's all a frame of mind. Same way if I accidentally piss on my leg I feel gross and need a shower, but if I do it as a prelude to masturbating it's fun and pleasurable.

Everything's about context. The frame that says zoophilia is violent, gross, and debasing gets a lot of reinforcement everything from organized religion to politicians fearmongering about people marrying their dogs as the slippery slope from same sex marriage. Also, movies or sitcoms frequently depict the pleasure of getting one's gentials licked by a dog while asleep, but becoming disgusted and angry upon waking to find your dog is the licker. This seems to naturalize and make incontrovertible the idea that we're a joke for maintaining the pleasure of the licking while conscious of its source, our enjoyment and love is their source for ridicule, a pleasure they see unfit for human enjoyment (looking at you Dodgeball); or the idea that being sexual contact with animals is an abberation, a phase, or mistake that must be paid for (Sleeping Dogs Lie).

So, after you've made peace with the fact that you may never win this war, it's time to prepare for the individual fields of battle. The best defense is a good offense. For those of you getting into relationships, rip the bandaid off early, and if for some reason you agree to avoid zoo activity stipulate that you'll revisit the issue at a fixed point to see if your feelings as a couple change as your lives change.

I would talk to someone for a week or two to get a feel for who they are. If they seemed open-minded, trustworthy, and I wanted to pursue things further with them I would slip into a getting to know you conversation that I watch and collect niche porn as one of my hobbies. It's natural for someone to ask "what kind?" I'd warn her, "I'm really kinky, you probably don't want to know!" Which always piques people's curiosity, but if they don't like it they remember you tried not to say, but they insisted you tell them anyway.

If they have a problem with zoo you just say something like: "Oh no, I would never do it because the ethics are too ambiguous with regards to consent. Can animals consent? But I can't help but be fascinated by the fact that they really are woman's best friend because their cock seems to have been shaped by God to perfectly stimulate the g-spot, while those furry balls slap the clit like mad. And man's best friend when swelling up right against the prostate. It's just so strange that they're better suited to fuck us well than we are to fuck each other!" You're pushing some suspicion off by raising an ethical issue (one you probably don't believe in), while offering them some positives to chew on that may bring them back to ask more once they process what you've said. If they're still convinced you fuck dogs and are a monster, this isn't someone you want in your life anyway, and you can always try to pull the old: "Oh my gosh! You should have seen your face! I really had you believing that didn't I?!?"

So, for example, I'll tell someone I'm really into panties, hotwife/cuckold, peeing (especially in public places one shouldn't), and zoophilia. You save the real kicker for last, because if they're gagging at piss porn or grasping their pearls at cuckoldry, you stop talking to them when it's polite to break it off/ghost. But that has literally never happened to me.

People have always been receptive, and usually just more curious than anything else. My wife's mother who is as conventional as could be and thinks I'm destined for Hell, didn't even make that big a deal of it when my wife told her about me–she just wanted to make sure I wasn't sticking a 7 inch cock into a 5 pound dog and basically stoped caring after that (which would be animal sexual abuse, no doubt). Talking honestly about my tastes has lead to conversations that are interesting and fun, and can usually segue to "well, do you just want to see for yourself?"

The only one of my friends who doesn't know expressed some extremely strong anti-zoophile sentiments to me completely unbidden in the first year we knew each other, and I have hid it from her since. But the more I've been thinking about it lately, I should have come out to her then and asked: "Do you mean me when you say that?" It's easy to caricature a group with no lobby, no above ground community, and one that's being criminalized more each year. I should have just explained interspecies consent and told my own story to make us real to her.

Don't let fear get the better of you. A lot of people knew I was into this stuff in high school and at first a couple people tried to give me shit over it, but once I responded like "Hell yeah, love it!" they realized it carries no power of shame over me and then people would come to me later with ernest questions about the logistics of fucking animals, or talk about the zoo porn they've been watching. It opened a lot of doors and closed none, but your mileage may vary. Just be sure to talk in the past tense, if you're unsure how the person will receive it. You can always admit to more current activity if they take it well.

Speaking of which, the best time is now to create or find a porn folder, video, or link that you think is the best sell of zoophilia to your partner. Your partner may never be willing to watch zoo stuff with you. But if they ever are, you don't want to be stuck going to the home page of FORBIDDEN_WEBSITE!, blindly hoping you're showing beast love at its best and not a shitty video: someone forcing an emaciated dog to do things it is struggling against (rape), avoid ambiguous situations like dildogging until your spouse is for sure on Team Zeta, and avoid video where the person is squealing in pain (unless your partner is a masochist who will find this a plus).

Think about the porn your spouse watches or the things that turn them on. Are they into public flashing? Maybe an outdoor dog fuck will get them going. Are they worried about the ability of animal to consent? Find that video where the woman is asleep in bed and her dog runs in and tears her panties off and pounces on her with a big grin on his face. If they need a narrative, pick one of the professional productions from Art of Zoo. Does your partner feel like zoo will leave them out? Show them doggy-couple threesome videos. If they have a lot of questions or have ADHD and can't focus on one thing for long, then maybe one of those explanatory compilation videos is up their alley.

Consider your unique situation, and find just a bit more porn than you think they'll want in case they surprise you and ask for more. Now, you're gonna stick this in a vault for an opportunity that may never come: maybe you're making your spouse exceptionally happy and they offer you one of those rare "anything you want" birthdays; or they get drunk one night and it suddenly seems less threatening and they are willing to engage with zoo in the moment; or maybe you work out a tit for tat deal where if you do X for them that's a big ask for you, then they'll watch a half hour of video with you or read along an erotic story.

You need to so some long hard thinking about where you're at as a couple, what goals you have individually and together about where you want to be in the future, and any unique history or attributes your spouse may bring to this issue. Think long-term: I'm thinking in terms of a 10 year horizon to try to sway her opinion.

I know that for all the reasons listed above my wife is unlikely to ever want to get dicked down by a dog. But I still have this strong belief that she would like it, if the legal situation were different, if the taboos weren't there, if the trauma was more resolved, etc. She has such a heart for animals and loves them very deeply. I feel it's reasonable to think in the long run that I may sway her to the position expressing that love physically is also good, but maybe that's the fantasy I need to keep going without going crazy.

My long-term strategy is not to force her to like zoo, let me do zoo, or anything other than try to create a supportive context in which zoophilia feels safe, fun, and interesting to explore. If you want a more extended take on this in a non-zoo context, read Emily Nagoski's Come As You Are, which teaches among other things finding your spouse's sexual brakes and figuring out how to ease the pressure on those brakes, so maybe the accelerator can take over. I had a lot more sex (and really good sex) in the year or so after I read that book and took it to heart (time for a re-read).

In my case, I'm never going to get anywhere until we're already actively doing foster care for so long it feels normal, then zoo might seem less of a threat that will affect her dream of being a mom. I would make this less stressful by promising never to take any video/photo and to only mate behind locked doors, so that it becomes a purely private state of affairs. She's going to have to make more progress with her mental and physical health, and I'm going to have to continue staying honest to rebuild trust, which will take at least twice as long as the timeframe in which I did the damage.

The key move in this strategy, as far as I see it is moving into a nonmonogamous relationship, and I think many of us struggling with a mixed zoophile–non-zoophile relationship may find success on that road. "May I have sex with animals?" is a lot less of a lift when "So you can fuck anyone you like" is the follow-up. I have been laying the stage for this for years. Check out Jane Hardy and Dossie Eaton's The Ethical Slut, Tristan Taormino's Opening Up and Franklin Veaux and Eve Rickart's More Than Two. I've read a lot of polyamory books and those are the three you need to read. Even if you stay monogamous, these books are a master class in effective communication and relationship building between intimate partners.

Because of my wife's insecurity, she's resisted for years the idea of me ever dating or having sex with anyone else but her, especially other women: she argued it's fair if we both have sex with any man we want, while I consistently pointed out for years that while I'm bi, I strongly prefer women and male dogs to men, so it's really not quite a fair arrangement. I fought that battle for maybe a couple years before I got anywhere, just planting seeds when the ground was fertile.

I suggested that we transition into nonmonogamy slowly. We start with hotwifing with strangers so that we're both equally involved and it's pure sex, no major emotions involved. She invited a stranger over and sucked him in our bed last year. She loves the idea of being spitroasted and trying out other cocks now. But it took years of offering, "hey I'm gonna be out of country so you have a hall pass!" that she never used, until one day it clicked and suddenly she's going nuts on Reddit, Bumble, and Tinder all at once.

We're not pulling the gun on more hotwifing until she reads one of those books and discusses it with me so we head off future fights that would be likely to happen by having a solid relationship agreement in writing. Make sure your relationship agreements (Taormina has a great checklist version of one in her book) time-limited so you can revisit what's working and not working for the two of you, and maybe the zone of comfort expands.

In our case, that will be to then move to cuckolding, so once I'm comfortable and used to her fucking others that she can do so on her own, and she wants to roleplay a cheating scenario to have an emotional tit for tat catharsis for all the lying I did to her during my alcohol dependence. It's mutually agreed upon and a one time event. Then after about a year of just men if things are going well we'll open the pool to playing with women and to polyamory. While she still has her jealous periods (usually correlating with money problems), she shocked me by spending our wedding night raving about how badly she wants to see another woman suck me and have her brains fucked out! She was so lesbophobic in the beginning of her looking at porn she'd cover the women in the video with her hand, vs every once in a while she has a day lusting after ladies now.

My point is what was once deemed impossible can become possible when you create the right environment for it to blossom, which is safe, supportive, and noncoercive (persuade, don't dictate). I took what she initially saw as a selfish move and pitched it into a hell of a deal for her (if somebody told me all I had to do was read a book and talk about it for about an hour to get permission to guzzle any and as many dicks as I like, I'd be reading so fast my eyes would ache). By finding out why she said "no" in detail I could work on turning those noes into yeses.

Once we're living something approximating our goals and she's hopefully fulfilled, then I'm going to ask her to do pet play, try a dildo modeled on a dog's penis, etc. to start easing it in, always waiting for the opportunity to show her the pornos that I think she will see herself refected in.

I hesitate to suggest drugs as an aid to this process, because that can go wrong in a thousand different ways, but if you're in a stable place in your life, some drugs are very effective at opening up the mind to new new possibilities and increasing suggestability. Psychedelics are renown for this and when dosed responsibly are among the safest drugs, but no drug is without risk of serious harms. LSD is among the most sexual psychedelics because it also hits the dopamine system, whereas serotonin is the primary target for this class. Dissociatives are great for opening the mind and heart, and inducing epiphany-type changes in people's sexual and gender identities; but they're also anesthetics, so they're not great sex drugs because the body is numb.

Then there are drugs to make you hornier than you've ever been in your entire life, willing to do things in bed you've never considered before, and the kinkier the better! Amphetamines are unparalleled for this. For example, you hear lots of stories from self-professed straight guys who spend 14 hours setting up Grindr dates and then delete the app when they sober up from meth. By the same token, you hear lots of stories about people discovering a new sexual interest under the influence and they are still just as jazzed about it when sober.

While meth is cheap, readily available, and very long-lasting, it's also by far the most toxic, habit forming, and likely to kill you of a heart attack, stroke, aortic dissection, or a dozen other ways, if you use slightly too much (never eyeball powdered drug doses of anything). Adderall, amphetamine sulfate (speed), 4-FA, etc. are all going to get you to that same pervy horniness, but are less hard on the body and have an easier comedown when dosed sensibly with a milligram scale! MDMA will get you the absolute best horny and loving high, and is less dose sensitive than meth, but it is even more neurotoxic when used in even small binges, and carries many of the same risks at high doses because it contains the meth molecule. Use MDMA once with a single redose taken at the half life no more than once every 3 months, ideally, otherwise you "lose the magic" as your brain permanently culls receptors to try to achieve homeostasis. And I can't personally vouch for for GHB, but people call it "liquid ecstasy" and take it at orgies, so it must do something good.

You can check out r/sexondrugs for more and always consult Psychonaut Wiki, Erowid, Tripsit.me, and the relevant drug and drug class subreddits to learn more about potential drug-drug interactions with your medications, supplements, and recreational substances, safe dosing, and harm reduction practices.

The biggest thing to understand is that drugs enable change for those who seek it; they cannot impose a change (the CIA tried and failed at this for decades). If your spouse can't let go of some hangups but desparately wants to, or is just open to whatever happens, knowing full and well that they may regret it in the morning, then you might really get somewhere. But if you're trying to drug your partner into fucking an animal when they don't at any level want to, not only will it not work, but that's also sexual assault because you are not respecting their established boundaries. Your partner better know that you're offering them a drug hoping it leads to zoosexual exploration before they take it. I cannot stress enough how much physical, emotional, spiritual, career, familial, and financial damage can accumulate in even a short span of chaotic drug use, and it can grab anyone in any type of a rough patch or with little structure and meaning to their day to day life.

One other idea I've played with is writing an erotic novel about my wife and fetishes. She's always said she will occasionally indulge my fetishes, but she doesn't really understand why I like what I like, or her even. So, I'd like to appeal to the inherent vanity of "omg someone is writing a novel about me!" I would ask her consent to do this before attempting it, because it could well backfire with her feeling that I'm telling her how to feel and think.

If she's willing, I want to write a chapter per fetish I have and leave the zoo one for last in case it's too much and she abandons it during that chapter. I think 20-40 pages of well-written fantasy could really get her juices flowing and dispel some of the concerns she has about the logistics of how a stud would fit into our life (she's terrified of the dog learning to fuck people and then being sexual toward our family and friends).

My big final pitch is going to be that having a canine lover can be just like cuckoldry or hotwifing; but the third guy is furry, always available, doesn't kiss and tell, won't cause any drama or transmit any STIs, that it could expand her capacity to love and live, and that it would surely make me the happiest man on Earth.
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Wow, thanks for sharing. May take some time for me to unpack some of this, but what I've read so far is very interesting and thoughtful (and thought provoking). I think a lot of us in this situation are frustrated to the point of inaction and looking for a way forward, so hoping this will help.
 
Was married but my zoo desires (among other things) ended that 12 year relationship. I had told her early on but she made me promise to never bring it up again. She was a wonderful person but very conservative about sex.

After that relationship I started dating someone who was more open minded. I told her early on about all my sexual desires to get everything out in the open. Repressed feelings just lead to resentment, so honestly and vulnerability were key. I told her about my past experiences with men, women, and non-humans.

I think she was a little shocked but asked lots of questions, ultimately accepting that part of me. Zoo isn’t for her, even though I’d love to have a K9 join us - but that’s ok. We still have a wonderful, open, and kinky sex life and are looking forward to getting a dog this year. No sex for her but we have a don’t ask don’t tell policy :)
 
Radhika said:
Opposite for me my husband doesn't know about my kink towards animals and he is not very horny type to like such things
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but think on the positive side, he already knows about your inclusion, you already have the opening to talk to him about it.
just go little by little showing him your pleasure that he can probably have.
 
Eevee said:
Not actually married but in a steady relationship with my boyfried for nearly 6 years.

He knew I was into dogs even before we got together and was ok with it. In that sense, I guess I am very fortunate.

He tolerates it in theory, meaning he is ok with me watching porn of it and using canine dildos, but everything real is a big no.
That is why I am kind of forbidden to bring a dog into the householkd/ relationship.

It is a combination of him feeling it is morally wrong and being a bit jealous.
We have been to therapy and nothing really came out of that.

I love him and don't want to hurt our relationship, but I just can't get that need out of me... :(
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if you already have the opening to talk about it, it's a big step.
in this case I believe that a lot of talking and showing that it will not affect his masculinity if you are being ridden by a dog is important.
often men can feel inferior but with enough conversation you can resolve it, you have to take it easy.
show him that it's your need.
 
RiverPhoenix said:
Wow, thanks for sharing. May take some time for me to unpack some of this, but what I've read so far is very interesting and thoughtful (and thought provoking). I think a lot of us in this situation are frustrated to the point of inaction and looking for a way forward, so hoping this will help.
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Yeah, I started writing that comment at like 5 AM and took a few breaks here and there for chores and errands; but I kept writing and revising until after 8 PM, so I would almost be insulted if it was a quick read given the level of effort lol. I could have cut it down a lot if I didn't write it on my phone. But I really appreciate the positive feedback, it encourages me to get more involved across ZooVille. I've been a chronic Twitter user, but it's too depressing now with constant bad news. I'm finding myself happier spending more of my time here where despite the occaisonal asshole videography critic, the content and people here seem to be positive, encouraging, and ethical.

I agree that I hope we can become a network of mutual support, developing strategies to get where we want to go, making peace with where we're at, or maybe for some of us this will be a turning point where we realize that we're not destined for the same path as our current partner and it's time to let them go their own way. I think we can all support each other in this tough, but hopefully rewarding journey.
 
Polyamorous and been in parts of my relationships for years. Have a couple of people I can roleplay or talk fantasy with but out of those maybe one *might* be into this but I don't want to risk the conversation. Main partner absolutely would not be into this.
 
upgrayeddd said:
I think my situation is worse than most people in that it doesn't stop just at zoo stuff, or even sex for that matter. Our relationship has always been incredibly rocky and she is super controlling and down right abusive sometimes. We don't have all that much in common in general really. That's all a long story though.

My wife is pretty damn vanilla and I will never get to enjoy 95% of what all I'm into, including my favorite fetishes like beast and watersports. She knows slightly about the watersports thing but thinks it is gross and it only ever gets brought up on rare occasions just to make a jab at me. She has no idea to the extent I actually like it.

She barely even tolerates me being bi and even had a panic attack when she found out a few months into dating me. There is zero chance of her being OK with beast stuff.

I'm curious about the people who have said they went to couples counseling about it though. Like I can't imagine how awkward that must have been. And what was the therapist's take on it?
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that's pretty rough… That's actually why I joined this site because honestly I don't want to deal with finding the perfect person and then only to lose them or lie to them about the zoo stuff ... i'm hoping I can find the perfect person through these kinds of forums... I feel like with gay men it's a bit easier because men are far more sexual and if you are sexually compatible at the start then you can create a really strong foundation for a great relationship ..i'm always curious about vanilla relationships where one partner is completely not vanilla... It sounds pretty rough... what attracted you to her in the first place? I personally think someone can love someone but if they do not share common interests (including sexual interests) with their sig... interests that can often be intrinsic to one's own identity then it's not going to be a strong and honest relationship… And if it's not a great relationship why stay in it? just my two cents. I really hope things get better for you but it really sucks that you have to hide the zoo aspect of your life :(
 
DobieDogo said:
i'm always curious about vanilla relationships where one partner is completely not vanilla... It sounds pretty rough... what attracted you to her in the first place? I personally think someone can love someone but if they do not share common interests (including sexual interests) with their sig... interests that can often be intrinsic to one's own identity then it's not going to be a strong and honest relationship… And if it's not a great relationship why stay in it? just my two cents. I really hope things get better for you but it really sucks that you have to hide the zoo aspect of your life :(
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You are very correct about needing common interests. I almost think sexual interests are more important to be compatible with. You can easily say "hey I'm going in the other room to play video games" (well, in a healthy relationship that is), but it is a bit harder to say "hey I'm going into the other room to suck the dog's cock and pee inside this chick's ass". Like many healthy couples have very different nonsexual interests and can give each other time to do them (and it is actually healthy to have time alone), but if it is very important that your partner do them with you, well that would probably be an issue too, but different than sexual interests. If I ever have another relationship in the future I not going to compromise much on sexual interests. They will have to love all my main ones in particular. I will probably compromise less on nonsexual ones too though, as I do want someone who understands me and can do some of them with me sometimes.

What attracted me in the first place was that she was cute and started talking to me. She seemed very interesting. I mean, it is easy for me to look back now and think "what the hell was I thinking?!" In regards to not just the current relationship but my other 2 long term ones.

What lead me to stay was emotional blackmail and their fear, obligation, and guilt tactics. And always some worry about them being violent. All long term relationships I've been in were with someone with a cluster B personality disorder.

I know there are a few reasons why things have gone the way they have gone. First, my mom has a personality disorder and is emotionally manipulative. When my dad finally divorced her when I was younger she made him out to be the devil to my sister and I. She still is obsessed with it to this day and will probably stay bitter about it till she dies. After years and years of hearing how horrible of a human being he was for leaving her and how "men should stay together with their wife/gf basically no matter what because you should never hurt them by leaving them like my dad did her" that kinda got hard coded in my subconscious. Despite being faced with senseless anger, violent outbursts, intense controlling behavior, insults, and more, the thought of breaking up felt even worse. On top of that though, they can go from the screaming tantrum of hate straight to wailing crying. In the current relationship there were times that I mentioned wanting a break from each other and it would go from anger and hate, sometimes slapping and such, straight to "please don't leave me it will crush me and I will have no reason to love anymore. I have had so many bad guys before and you are the first good one" in a split second." That of course, beyond my typically extremely logical brain, would trigger the teachings of the past and instead of sticking to it I would back down immediately. Of course to seal the deal they would become extremely loving for a week or so after. "I hate you, don't leave me" sums it up perfectly (actually a book title about the subject). It becomes constant survival mode trying to keep them happy so your life isn't hell.

In my first 2 relationships they ended up leaving me themselves. I swore I would never put myself in that position again, but the current one's tactics were more advanced and I wasn't ready. I didn't learn all this self awareness I'm regards to relationships until I was already deep into the current one. One thing you have to understand with people like them is you can't just say you are unhappy and want to split up and you sleep in separate rooms until you find a place to live and then they let you collect all your things peacefully. It is an onslaught of continuously escalating tactics from the point you say you are breaking up.

Secondly, I had horrible self esteem growing up and am cursed to have bad luck with women. I had maybe 1 or 2 girls in highschool that showed some interest but they were very much not my type. I didn't get a gf until I was 19, and that was my first ex. Despite her craziness I was just so happy to finally have someone that I ignored it all. We also had a child which I was more or less tricked into (I was young, dumb, and full of cumpletely bad decisions), so she also had our child to manipulate me with. There were other ways each found a way to trap me deeper into it as well.

In any case, in each instance I let my strong desire for love and companionship outweigh logic and self respect.
 
dogdaddylover8900 said:
My wife is not into it. She said it's gross but was turned on by how hot I was getting but she doesn't think she ever could do Anything. She wants me to get counseling to make my urges go away, like it's wrong. ?
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Maybe your counselor will be into it, and suggest in depth counseling, to cure you of course ?
 
phillippe69 said:
so have you had sex with a dog away from your house with his blessing?
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I did/ had only before we were together.
After that any actual zooie fun - just like smoking - has stopped completely for me.

Again, I would not know how to actually do it.

I have tried to make contact to other members in my region (dog owners as well as just other likeminded peaople) but contact never really lasts and nothing real comes out of it.

And to a degree I totally get why.
Can't blame owners for not "lending/whoring" their partners out to other zoos, least to a stranger they met online.

Still, what is somebody like me to do if he does not want to resort to fencehopping?
 
jackBristol said:
It is a great relationship if he has accepted you and your desire. He is a good boy. Well done for respecting each others ?
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Yes he is, thanks :)

I am well aware how much a compromise this already is from his side. he means the world to me and that makes this conflict even worse.

He even suggested watching zoo porn together during sex, even though he might not care for it at best or might even be a bit disgusted by it at worst. Or to intergrate it in some kind of role- / pet-play.

Both seem like a poor substitute for the real thing to me and I would be too ashamed anyway, though xD
 
Brazool said:
if you already have the opening to talk about it, it's a big step.
in this case I believe that a lot of talking and showing that it will not affect his masculinity if you are being ridden by a dog is important.
often men can feel inferior but with enough conversation you can resolve it, you have to take it easy.
show him that it's your need.
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Yes, I think we are at a pretty good place already.

The problem is not really that he can't stand the thought of me having sex with a dog in the sense that he might not be good enough for me.

As I mentioned, he would allow me to have sex with someone else's dog outside of our home. So as long as he does not have to be there while it happens and it is not our own pet it happens with, it would kind of be ok for him. But that in turn is a scenario I hardly ever see becoming reality...
 
RiverPhoenix said:
I am fairly new here and not sure if this thread will be helpful or just duplicative (if so feel free to ignore), but I see a few conversations going back a ways about married persons (male and female) either who can't tell their partner, their partner isn't interested, etc.. Thought maybe a consolidated thread for those of us in that situation might be a good way for some us to share our interests and experiences, what we hope to get out of being here, connect with like-minded individuals, etc. Or is there a group for this or should there be (I have no idea how the groups work lol)? Or feel free to message me directly if you want to discuss. My preference is to discuss not so much what's wrong with our current situation or partner (some people just aren't into it) but focus on more on what we can do to feel more fulfilled living with this interest. Hopefully that makes sense to someone out there. :)
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Just seen this thread after a huge time away..... apart from this here site, I cannot find others into what I like....even on here, I can't seem to find anyone within reasonable distance from myself. Everyone seems to be overseas!

As my gf doesn't like this at all, I am here to hopefully find kind souls to talk to, and live in hope that someone may offer to share, or want to enjoy this with me....
 
Nadia4u2 said:
I feel the same way. A lot in my marriage is great. But zoo is something I have to keep absolutely a secret. I think about it all the time though.
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I know how it is.
and when you are walking down the street and see a beautiful dog and in my case with a beautiful woman, it makes me want to talk to my wife.
 
RiverPhoenix said:
I am fairly new here and not sure if this thread will be helpful or just duplicative (if so feel free to ignore), but I see a few conversations going back a ways about married persons (male and female) either who can't tell their partner, their partner isn't interested, etc.. Thought maybe a consolidated thread for those of us in that situation might be a good way for some us to share our interests and experiences, what we hope to get out of being here, connect with like-minded individuals, etc. Or is there a group for this or should there be (I have no idea how the groups work lol)? Or feel free to message me directly if you want to discuss. My preference is to discuss not so much what's wrong with our current situation or partner (some people just aren't into it) but focus on more on what we can do to feel more fulfilled living with this interest. Hopefully that makes sense to someone out there. :)
Click to expand...
Nope I JUST GOT DIVORCED!!!!!!! so happy.
 
It took me a while (about 10 years) to open up about my 'porn taste'. Generally I dont like normal porn at all- way too much ego, abuse and baggage as well as just naked people not being exciting. I much prefer animals for many reasons although I've still not made it a reality! We took ecstasy together and you can have some deep,deep heart to heart conversations ... that's when it came out. My partner is very supportive and wants to watch my/zoo porn with me but.. I feel totally different and like he is judging me/ watching over my shoulder and that anxiety is a turn off for me. That's my own problem though.
 
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