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French Zoophile Crisis. Please read the details.

I was asked to repost this message here from the admin of zoolibre and the french zoophilia wiki. It is translated from french to english. Please be aware further developments may take place. Please have these zoos in your hopes and minds, as they are being railroaded by a false accusation.

Selon plusieurs sources concordantes, une instruction judiciaire est en cours concernant un groupe d'individus autours des sites francophones zoolibre et animalzoofrance
Je n'ai pas réussi à savoir s'il s'agissait des créateurs, de modérateurs ou de visiteurs.
According to several concording sources, a judicial investigation is opened about a group of people surrounding the french websites zoolibre and animalzoofrance
I don't know yet if this about the creators, moderators or visitors.


Des perquisitions ont été menées chez 3 personnes ce mardi 29 juin : des téléphones et disques durs ont été saisis.
Les informations concernant l'hébergement du forum zoolibre sont donc peut être actuellement dans les mains des forces de l'ordre. Je n'ai pas réussi à en obtenir la certitude. Mais dans le doute, il vaut mieux prévoir le pire.
Ce n'est donc peut être qu'une question de semaines avant qu'ils mettent complètement la main dessus.
Tant que les fondateurs n'auront pas fait de message officiel, pour confirmer ou démentir ces informations, on ne peut que faire des suppositions.
S'ils ne s'expriment pas publiquement rapidement, c'est peut être qu'ils n'ont pas la capacité de le faire, donc cela irait dans le sens du "pire".
Search have been made at home of 3 people this tuesday 29th june : phones and hard drives have been taken from the juge.

Informations about hosting of zoolibre board may be actually in the hands of the justice. I don't have the certitude. But in the doubt, it's better to think the worst.
It may be only a question of weeks before they take down the hosting of the board.
Since the creators would not have made a declaration, fo confirm or reject this informations, we can only make suppositions.

If they don't speak quicky, maybe it's because they can't do it yet, do this will make me think that the "worst way" may be what is currently happening.


D'après ce que j'ai pu en savoir, du nettoyage a été fait de façon préventive sur le serveur de zoolibre :
- Les messages privés ont été désactivés et supprimés
- Les sauvegardes ont été supprimées
- Les mots de passes des comptes d'administration ont été changés
- Les logs d'accès Apache ont été supprimés
From my researches, cleaning has been make in a preventive way on the server hosting zoolibre :
- private message have been deleted and disabled
- backup have been deleted
- password of the admin account has been updated
- Apache log access have been deleted



En clair, d'après une personne avec qui j'ai pu échanger, le serveur ne contiendrait plus aucune donnée sensible, mais il ne sait pas si des sauvegardes existent coté hébergeur, qui pourraient être mises à disposition de la justice.
Actually, after talking to 1 of the 3 personn, the server should not contain any sensitive data anymore, but he doesn't know is backup exist from hosting side (maybe the society who host the server made private backups) who could be transfer to justice.


Pour le background, de ce que j'ai pu comprendre :
Une instruction judiciaire a été ouverte suite à une plainte contre X de M Benoit Thomé, président de l'association Animal Cross.
Les motifs sont les suivant : harcèlements, menaces de mort, usurpation d'identité.

Je peux vous affirmer, pour connaitre leur façon de "militer", que les personnes autours des sites zoolibre ou animalzoofrance n'ont ABSOLUEMENT rien à voir avec ces faits.
Dès qu'elles décideront (ou pourront) sortir de leur silence, je suis sur qu'elles confirmeront mes propos.
I can assure, because I know how they militate, that people surrounding the websites zoolibre or animalzoofrance, are ABSOLUTLY not behind this facts.
As soon as they'd decide (or could) speak, I'm sure they will tell I'm right.


Est ce que les menaces reçue par Animal Cross sont réelles ? ou bien est ce un montage de fausses preuves créé pour monter une plainte contre X ? Le temps nous le dira, mais j'ai ma petite idée là dessus.
Are the threats received by Animal Cross real ? or maybe it's false documents, made to open a jusdiciary investigation ? Time will say, but I have my personnal opinion about it.


Une juge d'instruction de Pau s'est saisie de l'affaire.
La zoophilie ne fait, à l'heure actuelle, pas "officiellement" parti de cette affaire.
An investigating juge is in charge of the story.
The zoophilia is, when I'm writing this, not "officialy" in the complaints.


La juge d'instruction est persuadée, surement sur conseil de M Thomé d'Animal Cross, que ces menaces proviennent d'AnimalZooFrance.
En effet, AnimalCross milite depuis près de 2 ans à alourdir la loi contre la zoophilie en France (le dossier est disponible ici : https://www.animalzoofrance.com/wiki/PPL_3661 )
Suite au passage à l'Assemblée Nationale, les parties concernant la lutte contre la zoophilie a été considérablement amoindri suite au refus des députés d'aller dans le sens d'une lutte aveugle.
Animal Cross a très très mal vécu ce revirement de la part des députés, et a lancé une pétition en ligne : https://www.mesopinions.com/petitio...e-nationale-deputes-reculent-denoncons/125603
The investigating judge is sure, probably because of Benoit Thomé, that those threats are coming from animalzoofrance.
Factually, AnimalCross is trying to push, for 2 years, a law modification against zoophilia. The study is on the french wiki : https://www.animalzoofrance.com/wiki/PPL_3661
When the law proposal was first seen by the french deputies, they rejected 90% of the content of the law proposition.
AnimalCross take this very badly, and they launched a online petition : https://www.mesopinions.com/petitio...e-nationale-deputes-reculent-denoncons/125603



Le site AnimalZooFrance se demandait comment allait réagir AnimalCross, sachant qu'ils ont très mal vécu cet évènement.
Nous tenons peut être là la réponse.
The website AnimalZooFrance was wondering how would react AnimalCross,according to the fact their law has been rejected by deputies.
Maybe we have the answer here.

Il y aurait donc eu une remontée depuis les informations des noms de domaine vers certaines personnes.
Ces personnes sont elles directement en lien avec animalzoofrance et zoolibre, ou s'agit il uniquement de redirection ou de prête nom ? Je ne le sais pas encore.
Mais dans le pire des cas, il peut s'agir des personnes qui ont déposé les noms de domaine.
Et encore dans le pire des cas, peut être est ce les créateurs eux même.
Justice certainly took information from the domain names, and those informations direct them to those 3 personn. Are those 3 personne linke with animalzoofrance or zoolibre, or are they some puppet, or intermediar personn ? I don't know yet
But in the worst possibility, it could be the people who bought the domain names.
And again in the worst case, it could be the creators themself.



L'instruction en cours, à travers les saisis et auditions réalisées, permettra donc de dire si oui ou non le site AnimalZooFrance est à l'origine des menaces reçues par Animal Cross.
La réponse est simple et d'une certitude à toute épreuve : non, il n'y aura aucun lien. L'instruction le démontrera.
Judicial investigation is on going, and after the justice would have analyzed the phone, hard disk, and listen to people, and it will say if animalzoofrance is behind the threats that Animal Cross received.
The answer is really simple and is really true : no, there will be no link. The investigation will show it.


Dès lors, on peut bien se demander pourquoi l'instruction a pris la direction d'AnimalZooFrance ?
So, one can ask why the investigation have been make to AnimalZooFrance ?


About the story, here is it what I'm understanding :
A judicial investigation has been opened after a complaint from Benoit Thomé, president of the french animal welfare association Animal Cross.
reasons of the complaint are : harassment, death threat, identity theft.


Cette plainte concerne au moins 4 menaces sérieuses qu'aurait reçu le président de l'association, Benoit Thomé, à savoir :
- une incitation faite à une association de la jeunesse musulmane de s'en prendre à Animal Cross envoyée par une adresse genre fdp.animalcross@gmail.com
- une autre incitation du même style, envoyée par une adresse mail en @protonmail.com
- des montages photos envoyée au domicile du couple Thomé montrant la tête de son épouse décapité, avec des insultes genre "on va t'attraper et te faire très mal"
- une photo reçu dans une enveloppe cartonnée envoyée par le site photobox
Visiblement, d'après le récit que j'en ai eu, l'aperçu de ces documents faisait froid dans le dos, avec des images avec du sang partout, une police d'écriture du style "sanglante" avec des "lettres qui coulent" comme si c'était écrit en sang.
This complaint is about 4 really threats possibily received by the president of the association, Benoit Thomé, which are :
- an incitation made to a muslim young association (like a school) asking to take weapons against Animal Cross (the french animal welfare association). The incitation has been sent from email like fdp.animalcross@gmail.com(fdp can be translate into sob for Soon of bitch)
- an other incitation, in the same way, send from a protonmail email
- photo montage sent to the home of Thomé family showing the head of his wife with the throat cut, with words like "we will rape and kill you"
- a photo receive at the home, sent from an commercial website who print photo and sent them through postal mail, photobox
According to the people with whom I speaked, the view this document was very horrible, with "bloody like" font style, like dropping blood
Sacre blue, Cest la tragir :(
 
It has become a risk but when you take a step back, it's not that bad.
Because before the law passed, you could be banned from having an animal for life, but it all depended on the judge.

Well it is true that with the new law 2 things have changed, it is a heavier sentence and being listed as a sex offender in the same way as pedophiles.

That the penalties are heavier, I doubt that it is really applied because the prisons in France are overloaded, but his Thomé does not seem to have understood it.
Then be listed as a sex offender in the same way as pedophilia.
Personally I have doubts about the effectiveness on zoophilia because no association, breeder and veterinarian has access to this list.
And I'm not sure that the legal police are entitled to give information, I think only time will tell.

Our weak point and which is also that of the anti zoophilia, is that technology, without technology they will have great difficulty in having us.
So what we have to do is to avoid having photos, video or other on bestiality.
I think that being in a zoophilia forum is not enough for us to be qualified as zoophilia and to be condemned for it (unless we have confessed of course).
Wait what??? Is this like, the actual law that's active right now? wtf.
 
Wait what??? Is this like, the actual law that's active right now? wtf.
French penal law 2021-1539 of 30 November 2021 changed the legal status of zoophilia from "sévices de nature sexuelle" to "atteinte sexuelle". I don’t know how to correctly translate those legal terms into English, but the meaning is:
-Before: Only active zoophilia (human penetration of an animal) is illegal (2 years/30kE),
-After: All sexual contact with animals is illegal, except for health care, hygiene care and artificial insemination.

Let’s say "animal sexual offense" (ASO) is the translation of "atteinte sexuelle sur animal".
Legal summary:
(1) personal ads and meetup1 year/15kEProposing or soliciting animals to commit an ASO,
(2) pornography on the internet2 years/30kESpreading ASO media on the internet,
(3) zoophilia3 years/45kECommitting or knowingly recording an ASO,
(4) zoophile(s)4 years/60kEAggravating factor, i.e. own animal or group.

-Regarding (3) and (4): confiscation of animals, deprivation of animals for life, pedophilia file, paid awareness training on animal cruelty, plus all kinds of horror (even chemical castration is possible).
-What is still legal: free speech (apologia), pornography (viewing, possessing, buying, distributing on physical media, fictional representation), zoophilia with a wild animal.

That complicated law was made by dogmatic people. It doubles the sentence (2 years/30kE x 2) and even goes further. Consider that the punishment for fence hopping is less than an act with your own pets. Ridiculous ! For additional information: https://www.animalzoofrance.com/wiki/Loi_courante_en_France
 
French penal law 2021-1539 of 30 November 2021 changed the legal status of zoophilia from "sévices de nature sexuelle" to "atteinte sexuelle". I don’t know how to correctly translate those legal terms into English, but the meaning is:
-Before: Only active zoophilia (human penetration of an animal) is illegal (2 years/30kE),
-After: All sexual contact with animals is illegal, except for health care, hygiene care and artificial insemination.

Let’s say "animal sexual offense" (ASO) is the translation of "atteinte sexuelle sur animal".
Legal summary:
(1) personal ads and meetup1 year/15kEProposing or soliciting animals to commit an ASO,
(2) pornography on the internet2 years/30kESpreading ASO media on the internet,
(3) zoophilia3 years/45kECommitting or knowingly recording an ASO,
(4) zoophile(s)4 years/60kEAggravating factor, i.e. own animal or group.

-Regarding (3) and (4): confiscation of animals, deprivation of animals for life, pedophilia file, paid awareness training on animal cruelty, plus all kinds of horror (even chemical castration is possible).
-What is still legal: free speech (apologia), pornography (viewing, possessing, buying, distributing on physical media, fictional representation), zoophilia with a wild animal.

That complicated law was made by dogmatic people. It doubles the sentence (2 years/30kE x 2) and even goes further. Consider that the punishment for fence hopping is less than an act with your own pets. Ridiculous ! For additional information: https://www.animalzoofrance.com/wiki/Loi_courante_en_France
Why "years" for a act that's not even violent?

Even solicitation is a automatic felony. This is completely Spartan punishment.
 
Why "years" for a act that's not even violent?
Yes,
Recently, a "normal" zoophile (no violence, no pedo…) was sentenced to two years (plead guilty to 50% of the four-year sentence) conditional imprisonment for having been sodomized by two of his dogs. Advocate argued the mental disorder to reduce the sentence (small fine).

 
Yes,
Recently, a "normal" zoophile (no violence, no pedo…) was sentenced to two years (plead guilty to 50% of the four-year sentence) conditional imprisonment for having been sodomized by two of his dogs. Advocate argued the mental disorder to reduce the sentence (small fine).

Wow you might as well kill someone with that kind of sentence to get your "money's worth"
 
French penal law 2021-1539 of 30 November 2021 changed the legal status of zoophilia from "sévices de nature sexuelle" to "atteinte sexuelle". I don’t know how to correctly translate those legal terms into English, but the meaning is:
-Before: Only active zoophilia (human penetration of an animal) is illegal (2 years/30kE),
-After: All sexual contact with animals is illegal, except for health care, hygiene care and artificial insemination.

Let’s say "animal sexual offense" (ASO) is the translation of "atteinte sexuelle sur animal".
Legal summary:
(1) personal ads and meetup1 year/15kEProposing or soliciting animals to commit an ASO,
(2) pornography on the internet2 years/30kESpreading ASO media on the internet,
(3) zoophilia3 years/45kECommitting or knowingly recording an ASO,
(4) zoophile(s)4 years/60kEAggravating factor, i.e. own animal or group.

-Regarding (3) and (4): confiscation of animals, deprivation of animals for life, pedophilia file, paid awareness training on animal cruelty, plus all kinds of horror (even chemical castration is possible).
-What is still legal: free speech (apologia), pornography (viewing, possessing, buying, distributing on physical media, fictional representation), zoophilia with a wild animal.

That complicated law was made by dogmatic people. It doubles the sentence (2 years/30kE x 2) and even goes further. Consider that the punishment for fence hopping is less than an act with your own pets. Ridiculous ! For additional information: https://www.animalzoofrance.com/wiki/Loi_courante_en_France
Oookay. This is scary.
 
So, a president of an association got threatened through some mail and it was enough to raid a few people and seize their data storages? I don't know the french law but it looks like they had something more than just the word of a president.
sounds like something extremely off the books imho
 
No, finally, we know exactly what happened.
The president of the association get many death threats, so justice opened a case.
One day, this president came to the justice, and said "I have a doubt on a guy, he was here at our conference on zoophilia, then he joined the association, and he asked to be part of the annual report meeting of the association. He gave his name, firstname, phone, but NOT his adress.
I think it's suspicious.

Then the justice asked Google infos about the email, then get the phone number, then put the guy's phone under listening.
They heard things about the new law who had to be voted, the guy spoke about the association, how they are using deputies to pass the law.
And, yes, this was enough to arrest them and search their homes.

They found nothing about death threats, but you can imagine they found many thing about zoophilia websites, videos, stories, pictures, militantism.
The case for the death threaths will be closed in less than 1 year. But the association got so many informations about the french zoo community, nobody know how it will use it.
He already published the name and adress of one guy on his association's website.
 
Hello, just to keep you informed.
The justice is still doing some verifications about the death threats.
Justice now knows that AnimalZooFranec is not behind those threats.

But the french association Animal Cross throught Benoit Thomé, his president, asked the justice to now investigate for zoophilia (animal sex abuse).
We do not know yet if the justice will accept this new search. We think they won't accept the request.

The guy who have been doxed by Benoit Thomé make a complaint last year, but he did not get news from it yet.

The justice agreed to give back the hard disks and phones who have been taken by the cops while search last year, but Benoit Thomé made an appeal. We'll know in mid-december if the justice accept or reject the appeal.
If they reject, the hardware will be given back to the owners.
If they accept, the hardware will be given to a french security-ministry related structured to try to decrypt them (the disk are encrypted)

Benoit Thomé thinks thoses drives contains many informations about the french community and contains datas about french wiki AnimalZooFrance and french board ZooLibre (which is now closed since this mess)

Whatever, ths disks CAN'T be uncrypted. Every people who got an account on zoolibre can breath.
The password was a 50 caracters long passphrase, with number, special caracters and cap caracters.

What we are VERY very afraid of, is that when the justice will say "we stop investigation", then Benoit Thomé will certainly put in public everything he got in the investigation. He got personnal datas about 10 persons (name, firstname, phone number, adress).
He got personnal datas about related, jobs and this kind of thing about some of this 10 persons.

We are pretty sure he will use those data to make a "full [fake] study" of the french zoo community. He'll probably invite french media (news paper online, maybe tv shows).
Even if he will not publish name or adress of people, he will surely publish datas who will permit to identify them (for example "a guy who work in the biggest horse structure in Paris is a zoophile").
I'm not sure we could make a complaint if the name is not published.

Stay thune, next message in december.
If you have questions, I can send them to involved people.

@ZTHorse @TogglesHappyZoo
 
There really should be a total reduction in laws in general. Not just specifically for zoo related stuff, but any crimes where there is no real physical harm. All these laws should be looked at and analyzed. Who is the law protecting, what good is it doing, what is the cost to enforce the law.

There is always a cost, to pretty much anything.
 
There really should be a total reduction in laws in general. Not just specifically for zoo related stuff, but any crimes where there is no real physical harm. All these laws should be looked at and analyzed. Who is the law protecting, what good is it doing, what is the cost to enforce the law.

There is always a cost, to pretty much anything.
Indeed. France once used to be a role model in this respect. This is from the French Declaration of the Rights of Man and of the Citizen, 1789:

“Liberty consists of doing anything which does not harm others: thus, the exercise of the natural rights of each man has only those borders which assure other members of the society the fruition of these same rights. These borders can be determined only by the law.” (IV)

“The law has the right to forbid only actions harmful to society. Anything which is not forbidden by the law cannot be impeded, and no one can be constrained to do what it does not order.” (V)

“The law should establish only penalties that are strictly and evidently necessary, and no one can be punished but under a law established and promulgated before the offense and legally applied.” (VIII)
 
Wow, it's strange to read this from somebody who is not french !
thanks you very much... And yes, this law is certainly against those basic rules.
 
Yeah let's hope a false flag and not complete removal of people's kinks and interests
 
The guy who have been doxed by Benoit Thomé make a complaint last year, but he did not get news from it yet.
Hu hu, that was destiny. We actually got news about this complaint for doxing.
The president of the association AnimalCross, Benoit Thomé, will be heard in april 2023, for doxing.
In France, doxing is illegal since a french teacher has been killed after his adress and college where he was teaching was published on social medias.
Doxing is punished, at worst, of 3 years of jail and a fine of 45 000€. This is the SAME penalty that the new french law against zoophilia, who have been passed because of this guy.
I don't think the guy will go in jail, but I'm sure he will be condamned.
He will be condamned if and only if the judge or the doxed personn can proove that Benoit Thomé knew that publishing the name and city of the guy could brind the doxed personn some problem.
Each publication he made on Facebook about zoophilia was followed by hundred of comments like you can imagine : "kill them all, cut their penis of kill them" etc
I can't imagine how the judge could even think that Benoit Thomé didn't know that the guy could have problems when he was publishing his name and city ...

It will be "nice" to have the guy who made zoophilia banned in France condamned, and not the people he thinks are zoophiles :)
After 3 people have been arrested because of his complaint for death threat, he published and article, saying : "when you see what they can do to a man, you can imagine what they can do to animals !". But the guys has not been condamned, because they are innocent. And finally, he will probably be condamned ...
Karma won ...
 
Yeah, if this happened in the US, especially now with all the stuff that’s been going on (it’s a shitshow and we’re just now into 2023), there’d be a lot more repercussions for everyone, not to mention a possible mass exodus, much like what almost happened in France. Let’s just hope nothing similar happens here (and it really can’t, given the complexities of state law combined with the general vagueness of federal law, unlike in France and most other countries where national law is streamlined and can affect just about every part of the country).
 
Just keep in mind that democracy around the world is not how it used to be. And no country will openly accept zoos either.
Not entirely correct openly publicly accepted No , tacitly accepted yes.
Take the UK not one prosecution under statute has been made in the last few years , a lesser charges being used , the most recent the man involved charged with being in possession of extreme pornography ie his partner filmed in the act the woman was never charged.
The sentence community service And fines totaling less than £200 .
 
Benoit Thomé was heard by the courts in April.
His association, Animal Cross, which made zoophilia illegal in France in 2021, had doxed the personal datas (name, firstname, city) of a person, presented as a zoophile.
In front of the bar of the court, he denied any direct implication in the facts. He explained that it was a mistake of his association, it never happened before.

He explained that he did not have the skills to publish an article on his website.
The prosecutor and the judge asked him to provide the identity of the person responsible: it is normally the director of publication who is legally responsible, and then the author of the article.
The director of publication, at this time, is Benoit Thomé, but at the time of the facts, in 2021, "it was not him".
The judge therefore asked who was the director of the publication in 2021: "It was someone else".
The prosecutor got carried away: "Look, you don't mind broadcasting the name of a person and saying that he is a zoophile, but give us the name of the director of the publication, will you not?" and no, Benoit Thomé confirmed that he would not provide this information.
The judge asked: "but was the modification of the director of the publication a subject of discussion within the association?"
"Yes yes, but there was no written report of the decision".
Similarly, the Prosecutor asks "Have there been internal sanctions, modifications to the functioning of your association so that this does not happen again?" "Decisions were taken, but no written decisions."
Basically, he defends himself by saying that it wasn't him, but without giving any evidence to prove it.

There is however a site, The WaybackMachine, which archives the maximum content of the Internet. The association's page from 2021 is stored: https://web.archive.org/web/20210925113429/https://www.animal-cross.org/mentions-legales/
It is clear that Benoit Thomé is the director of publication in 2021.
Why did he lie? Because in France, the law is not like in the USA: the culprit (the guy who make an infraction) and the victim must exchange before the trial the documents, the evidence, on which their demonstration (their accusation) will rely.
Benoit Thomé's lawyer, a very famous French lawyer, Hélène Thouy, only sent her demonstration to the victim the day before the trial, who therefore did not have time to read it, and to add the copy of The WayBack Machine site to the case folder.

So we have Benoit Thomé who lied to justice, helped by Hélène Thouy who flouted the code of ethics for lawyers.

The judge's decision will be given in June. We cannot say whether Benoit Thomé will be condemned or not, but we now have proof that he follows no law except his own. He does not hesitate to lie to justice to avoid being condemned.
The victim was convinced that Benoit Thomé had pleaded guilty, and had therefore not taken this defense strategy into account.

If Benoit Thomé were not convicted, it will be possible to have the trial canceled given that his lawyer did not send the elements of the file within a reasonable time before the trial (the day before is not a reasonable time).
 
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