Do trained dogs have free will?

[Pillar]

for sure I think for the most part we aim n succeed for the most part in that pursuit of free will...
as much as we are 'allowed' by the few that call the shots.
I guess a k9 would/could disobey a command to bite if he wished.....I wonder.....

You summed it up almost perfectly, as the "few" are actually the many. Millions of people in governments control the lives of us peons to an extent that most cannot and will not realize lest they fall apart and mentally break entirely.

 

[Pillar]

Simple answer is no.

Complicated answer is that no one has free will. Often our subconscious mind makes decisions before you're even aware you've made them for yourself. Outside factors can of course change your opinion, but only because your subconscious opinion has been changed by this external information. As intelligent as we like to think we are, both humans and dogs are conditioned to follow basic patters as well as societal/external expectations. Dogs and humans both seek comfort in seeking patters.

As Sam Harris puts it:
"Free will is an illusion. Our wills are simply not of our own making. Thoughts and intentions emerge from background causes of which we are unaware and over which we exert no conscious control. We do not have the freedom we think we have."

Your subconscious mind certainly can play a role but there's ways around this, from paying attention to your own thoughts all the way to meditation (assuming it works as advertised).

 

[saddlebum66]

You're welcome to feel that way....you might even find that happening, if you live a few thousand years. If you do, I wonder what you'll try to do to stay alive. I'm sure you'll say. " Nothing" NOW, but that's an easy statement to make right up til it starts happening, and you recognize it.

Humanity isn't always what we'd wish it to be, but as far as ANYONE knows....we're all there is. You're always free to check out, friend.

 

[saddlebum66]

Double posted

 

[Panda Chen]

This is subjective but I think they would likely attack if given the order. Where I think the free will comes in is that only the dogs that are receptive to that kind of training make it to that point. A lot of dogs are rejected at some point in the training because they won't do certain things. Unfortunately in some places those dogs are put down but it is unlikely they know that is the consequence.
The ones that make it to be fully trained have chosen to accept that training. When they are choosing puppies they look for certain traits that will predispose a dog to being trainable in that way. Same with assistance dogs. Not all dogs are willing to be trained for a particular task. Those that are have chosen to be that, those that are not are rejected.

 

[Tailo]

It's always sickened me studying medieval (and, well, actually as far forward as WWI) history or watching movies set in that era and seeing how it was establish and accepted tactic to target a mounted combatant's horse. All because it was the larger and easier target to bring down. An innocent animal being murdered all because it was forced into the middle of petty human squabbles.

The one who targeted the animal wasn't the one who forced it into the middle of petty human squabbles. I think it would be more appropriate to be sickened by the person who put the animal there than by the persons who do their best to survive the confrontation with the horse-rider team.

 

[Tailo]

A dog HAS no free will, whatever you may think. That's why they're DOGS. Like it or not Humans created them.

Being created does not rule out free will. Furthermore I would like to add that not only were dogs shaped by humans, but humans were also shaped by dogs. Domesticated animals and dogs in particular played a huge role in the history of civilization.

 

[Reconscope]

This is subjective but I think they would likely attack if given the order. Where I think the free will comes in is that only the dogs that are receptive to that kind of training make it to that point. A lot of dogs are rejected at some point in the training because they won't do certain things. Unfortunately in some places those dogs are put down but it is unlikely they know that is the consequence.
The ones that make it to be fully trained have chosen to accept that training. When they are choosing puppies they look for certain traits that will predispose a dog to being trainable in that way. Same with assistance dogs. Not all dogs are willing to be trained for a particular task. Those that are have chosen to be that, those that are not are rejected.

Excellent answer i am glad you opened this thought with us.

 

[Reconscope]

Being created does not rule out free will. Furthermore I would like to add that not only were dogs shaped by humans, but humans were also shaped by dogs. Domesticated animals and dogs in particular played a huge role in the history of civilization.

So very true they came from wolves afterall in the "early game" humans had to depend on them to survive in certain situations.

 

[dartel]

The one who targeted the animal wasn't the one who forced it into the middle of petty human squabbles. I think it would be more appropriate to be sickened by the person who put the animal there than by the persons who do their best to survive the confrontation with the horse-rider team.

Oh I most certainly do blame the person forcing the animal into the conflict too. And both persons are fucking morons for going to war to begin with.