You're damn right I'm emotional about it!
That age is nowhere near the age of physiological (or psychological) maturing!
Are we the most persecuted minority?
- Thread starter UniqueAmerican
- Start date
That age is nowhere near the age of physiological (or psychological) maturing!
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BlueBeard
Guest
If you think I would be arguing for it, recheck your language settings in Translate.Google. They're off about 180 degrees.
Looks like the discussion has turned more into "how many of us are there?" which, I won't touch.
But to answer the basic question of, are we the most persecuted minority, it depends how you look at it. On one hand, you could say that we are because the amount of social stigma we get is ludicrous. Zoophilia is often regarded as either a joke, or the most disgusting thing ever, and so I would say people view us as being amongst the lowest of the low, right there with rapists and pedophiles, which I don't think is just, but I believe that's how we really are seen. So in the sense that most people feel like we're fine to discriminate against, we could be the most persecuted.
But then, another part of me thinks we're far from the most persecuted, but that's only because we're not a very visible minority. You can't persecute the "degenerate" you're not even aware of. Zoophilia is a mutable characteristic, unlike race, for example, and so we're more easily hidden. Kinda like psychopaths - they might be round up into concentration camps, if psychopathy were impossible to hide. But it's not. It's very easy to hide, just as zoophilia is.
Is the need to keep hidden a sign of persecution? Hard to tell - I have a feeling you could Philosophise back and forth on this for quite a while.
If I'm being real, I think I'll settle to say that we're not the most persecuted. As others have said before, other minorities have it worse.
But to answer the basic question of, are we the most persecuted minority, it depends how you look at it. On one hand, you could say that we are because the amount of social stigma we get is ludicrous. Zoophilia is often regarded as either a joke, or the most disgusting thing ever, and so I would say people view us as being amongst the lowest of the low, right there with rapists and pedophiles, which I don't think is just, but I believe that's how we really are seen. So in the sense that most people feel like we're fine to discriminate against, we could be the most persecuted.
But then, another part of me thinks we're far from the most persecuted, but that's only because we're not a very visible minority. You can't persecute the "degenerate" you're not even aware of. Zoophilia is a mutable characteristic, unlike race, for example, and so we're more easily hidden. Kinda like psychopaths - they might be round up into concentration camps, if psychopathy were impossible to hide. But it's not. It's very easy to hide, just as zoophilia is.
Is the need to keep hidden a sign of persecution? Hard to tell - I have a feeling you could Philosophise back and forth on this for quite a while.
If I'm being real, I think I'll settle to say that we're not the most persecuted. As others have said before, other minorities have it worse.
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TeslaModel3
Guest
I wouldn't say we're the most persecuted. I'd say second most persecuted. As sad as it sounds, it helps that many people don't know that we exist. If they did, then we might become the first. Although the only way for us to be no longer persecuted is for people to know the truth and make up their own minds
Agreed that many don't think about us at all. But people still care more about children than animals. Children can be scared for life if abused by an adult. Animals not so much.
HoundDogRuffDog
Zooville Settler
I honestly think most people just pretend to care about zoophiles existing and rail on them just to make themselves look better. A lot of them people who are themselves zoo, but want to cover their tracs. It has happened so many times in the community, a self-loathing zoo has outed others to feel superior.
I'm pretty sure 95% of people are either meh or completely okay with zoophilia and the 5% are actually repulsed by it.
I mean.. some people hate broccoli. Some even hate strawberries. There just is not a societal pressure to condemn it and a pressure to keep your own image clean.
I'm pretty sure 95% of people are either meh or completely okay with zoophilia and the 5% are actually repulsed by it.
I mean.. some people hate broccoli. Some even hate strawberries. There just is not a societal pressure to condemn it and a pressure to keep your own image clean.
wow i can bet i will see this everywhere by each of the "paraphilias"
"we whateverphiles are good and love whoever those other someotherphiles are bad and have a mental illness"
don't you see what the psychologist says about you. i'm sure you do but you are just saying they are wrong so why on earth can't it apply to other philes. its amazing how everyone is attacked in the same way and still support the same people that attack them when they attack someotherphiles
www.psychologytoday.com
"we whateverphiles are good and love whoever those other someotherphiles are bad and have a mental illness"
don't you see what the psychologist says about you. i'm sure you do but you are just saying they are wrong so why on earth can't it apply to other philes. its amazing how everyone is attacked in the same way and still support the same people that attack them when they attack someotherphiles
Bestiality: Hidden Facts About the Sexual Abuse of Nonhumans
A summary about humans having sex with animals is shocking.
www.psychologytoday.com
To answer OP, you are the second mostly prosecuted. The first is pedophiles as @Gemini75 said
The least is necrophiles
@ZTHorse "Adult animals" you know that's something you all say. Pretending to be an anti-zoo and giving you pictures of different animals at different ages, tell me can you tell me which is "ADULT" and which is "CHILD" and why for all animals?
If you're a guy who's fucking animals. and they didn't call you animal rapist or animal abuser, you're lucky. I just don't see this often. but if you can show where people are okay with the guy doing it I'd love to see
Zoophiles and pedophiles that act on it can be killed if found. Since you get the label sex offender, so no, I think you both are treated the same way.
The least is necrophiles
@ZTHorse "Adult animals" you know that's something you all say. Pretending to be an anti-zoo and giving you pictures of different animals at different ages, tell me can you tell me which is "ADULT" and which is "CHILD" and why for all animals?
i disagree.
If you're a guy who's fucking animals. and they didn't call you animal rapist or animal abuser, you're lucky. I just don't see this often. but if you can show where people are okay with the guy doing it I'd love to see
Zoophiles and pedophiles that act on it can be killed if found. Since you get the label sex offender, so no, I think you both are treated the same way.
caikgoch
Esteemed Citizen of ZV
First, we don't go to animal dating clubs for hookups with strange animals. Particularly if you favor large animals (horses) like I do, you need to establish trust and a certain kind of relationship before you move on to sex. I know "raw animal sex" is a popular concept but I invite you to watch some horse breeding vids. Note the extent that many owners go to in protecting their horses from each other. If a 1200 lb horse can get hurt what does it say about my chances?
Second, yes I can look at any horse that you give me enough of a picture of and tell you if they are mature. I can also tell you stallions from mares without seeing the genitals. If you spend enough time with them, you learn things like this. If you make too many mistakes with horses, you either learn or die trying.
I said anti-zoo as they push the rules. They won't even see those vids and just say you are making excuses. I would like to see if you can show "Adult animals" outside this forum
Please provide examples of differences. Anyone can say that (and they do). The "child horse" doesn't become a stallion or mare after 1 second.
Edit: I did not know what the two words meant, sorry ?
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@d3bbievictor is right. you can look it up. one think to note is when someone enters puberty before 8 the "scientist" say they have an illness :/
Puberty is about reproduction, even fetus has "masturbated" oral would be same but studies are illegal. Proof of Penetration When a girl, is like proving an animal like being fucked by a guy.
Say again? But more legible this time please.
HoundDogRuffDog
Zooville Settler
Yeap. Same here, but for dogs.
I find the notion of not knowing if an animal is mature from a picture really weird. I can tell from a picture of a human if they are a child, teen or an adult, and I can see with the same if even not more precision if a dog is certain age.
I can tell a lot from just seeing a picture.
I've used this skill to help, in fact. I have a hobby of browsing dog sale sites and reporting all dogs that are clearly afraid, or fraudsters selling too thin and ill puppies. People who might not know dogs all too well might not pick on the nervous faces of those puppies, but I can tell. I can see if the puppies are way too young to be weaned yet or older than claimed.
It's really disingenuous to claim one well-accustomed with a certain species of animal would not know if the animal is mature?
caikgoch
Esteemed Citizen of ZV
Most mammals have the very same sexual dimorphism. Stallions have larger heads and much stronger necks. Mares have much wider hips. Got any idea where the phrase "look a gift horse in the mouth" came from? It's because you can age a horse very accurately by looking at their teeth. Mature stallions have extra teeth, BTW.
All it takes is experience. When you have a large enough set of examples to compare, you can tell a lot at a glance. You also can learn a lot from their behavior. Horses have adolescent emotions and many of the same behaviors for the same hormonal reasons. Look up "Premarin". It's horse hormones used in human medicine.
You could not understand or could not accept?
@d3bbievictor is right. you can look it up. one think to note is when someone enters puberty before 8 however, the "scientist" say they have an illness :/
Puberty is about reproduction, even foetus have been known to "masturbate", oral sex would also be fun in the same way, however, since research is illegal, all I can tell you is that it involves similar intermediate processes of pleasure, except that someone else does it, and not themselves. Proof of Penetration with a girl, is same as proving an animal like being fucked by a guy.
Edit: since oral sex will also include girl sucking a guy’s dick which, I would agree is not same as girl masturbating - the oral above is everything other than this, sorry
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Anti-zoo reply
Nope! Never heard of that. You totally missed out on how the "child horse" becomes a stallion or mare, I wonder why...
Anyone can say "When you have a large enough set of examples to compare, you can tell a lot at a glance. You also can learn a lot from their behavior." and a adolescent is not a legitimate adult, as it is between 10 and 19.
I ignored Premarin, since it would have no value to them and will not give you any support.
You talked about what you see on horses or just general differences, if you want people outside to listen, especially antis, you have to give them things they like about "adult horses". For example, why do we use "adult horse" on horseback riding, and why "adult horse" are the best and most trusted lifelong companions. It is better not to talk about sex now, it will only make them hate it. When they accepted the idea of why "adult horses" are good companion than the sex-related things can be added. As you said before, trust and relationship comes first.
Only you see this and other people like you!
Nope! Never heard of that. You totally missed out on how the "child horse" becomes a stallion or mare, I wonder why...
Anyone can say "When you have a large enough set of examples to compare, you can tell a lot at a glance. You also can learn a lot from their behavior." and a adolescent is not a legitimate adult, as it is between 10 and 19.
I ignored Premarin, since it would have no value to them and will not give you any support.
You talked about what you see on horses or just general differences, if you want people outside to listen, especially antis, you have to give them things they like about "adult horses". For example, why do we use "adult horse" on horseback riding, and why "adult horse" are the best and most trusted lifelong companions. It is better not to talk about sex now, it will only make them hate it. When they accepted the idea of why "adult horses" are good companion than the sex-related things can be added. As you said before, trust and relationship comes first.
HoundDogRuffDog
Zooville Settler
I replied as an ant-zoo and what you said would be of no use and would not help you.
I asked you this
Remember outside this forum that you are called animal abusers. Put yourself in their shoes if an animal abuser says things like what you say, will you hear or think they are delusional and only try to legalise animal abuse. I have seen many zoophiles talk about being mature just like a human adult, But many fail to see society treats them like children as they are fed and cared for, so they will only see how you take advantage of them.
Homosexuals learnt this, too, because they know the act is good and not perverted, and no one can hear it, and people can't tell it because the act is completely illegal. Instead, they decided to pursue the idea of romance, because it is something shared between gay and lesbian people, and that there is no need to have sex, and that the only thing most of them would agree on.
In your case, this action is not completely illegal, but psychologists and other scientists will bombard you with multiple animal sexual abuse cases and say that it is worse than the good cases you have shown. This is why I said a give examples of things they would like
@HoundDogRuffDog
HoundDogRuffDog
Zooville Settler
I replied as an ant-zoo and what you said would be of no use and would not help you.
I asked you this
Remember outside this forum that you are called animal abusers. Put yourself in their shoes if an animal abuser says things like what you say, will you hear or think they are delusional and only try to legalise animal abuse. I have seen many zoophiles talk about being mature just like a human adult, But many fail to see society treats them like children as they are fed and cared for, so they will only see how you take advantage of them.
Homosexuals learnt this, too, because they know the act is good and not perverted, and no one can hear it, and people can't tell it because the act is completely illegal. Instead, they decided to pursue the idea of romance, because it is something shared between gay and lesbian people, and that there is no need to have sex, and that the only thing most of them would agree on.
In your case, this action is not completely illegal, but psychologists and other scientists will bombard you with multiple animal sexual abuse cases and say that it is worse than the good cases you have shown. This is why I said a give examples of things they would like
That makes no sense.
People already understand others can truly, deeply love their animals, it's not an issue at all.
You can go outside in front of a large audience and cuddle and kiss a dog while saying "OH I love you THE MOST in the WHOLE WORLD mwah mwah mwahh!!" and people would maybe just think you're a sap.
There even are contests where people try to be as over-the-top loving and blather nonsensical love words to their dogs and the most outrageously blathery one gets the prize (yes, honestly lol)
What we need to normalize or at the very least legalize right now, is sex with animals specifically.
I agree. But as I said, you lot see this, but they see it as abuse. Didn't you read what I said about homosexuals telling you why you can't jump to sex, a lot of zoophiles says trust and relationships come first so why not focus on it?
You will have to fight for sex like that or not, but abuse should become love for zoophiles first
I say forget normalization - if there people don't want to accept it, that is their choice. Most zoos don't have animal sex for public approval - they do it because that is a part of who they are. My issue here is when zoos are imprisoned for having loving, sexual relationships with their pets/animals and it gets labeled as "abuse".
HoundDogRuffDog
Zooville Settler
I agree. But as I said, you lot see this, but they see it as abuse. Didn't you read what I said about homosexuals telling you why you can't jump to sex, a lot of zoophiles says trust and relationships come first so why not focus on it?
You will have to fight for sex like that or not, but abuse should become love for zoophiles first
We are not jumping right into sex. We already have acceptance to love our animals like family.
Pillar is right in that we are secluded and mind our own business. Most zoos will never make a peep, and I was one of them. My mind has changed during the years and I'd wish for things like better resources and better sexual education and legalization world-wide.
Laws will never stop us, never have, but it would be such a benefit to be vocal that I cannot ignore it anymore :9
When people fight for legalization it is usually about the community, not about themselves
I think the problem with the "persecution" of zoophiles is that aside from the outright legal cases, it's mostly percieved rather than actual. That is, zoophiles think everyone around them would condemn them for being zoophiles, but they don't really know because they never ask anybody. That makes it difficult for zoophiles to really claim they are a "persecuted minority" because there's so few actual incidents of people getting harassed, abused etc. for being zoophiles, the problem is more psychological than practical, because the vast amount of zoophilia is secret.
That's not to say that it's not true that a lot of people hate zoophiles, but the worst problem for many zoos is that they would never even consider being open about it. Ultimately, more openness has to be the goal, but it's still a long way there.
That's not to say that it's not true that a lot of people hate zoophiles, but the worst problem for many zoos is that they would never even consider being open about it. Ultimately, more openness has to be the goal, but it's still a long way there.
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Tailo
Guest
When people fight for legalization it is usually about the community, not about themselves
It can be about ideals, too. A generally strong sense for justice can be the motivation to act. It's not easy to accept for an idealist when people are prosecuted and punished for a victimless "crime", even when they have only weak ties with the community. (It's also difficult for someone who loves justice to accept when people are not prosecuted for harming an animal. So an idealist who understands that sex with animals can be mutual fun would typically argue for both legalization of responsible sex and for the prosecution of harmful acts.)
I've also met someone where I had the feeling that they were doing it for recognition or "fame" among zoos. Motivations vary and different motivations can come together in the same person.
Being a zoo is not that bad if:
a) the public doesn't know
b) you live in a civilized country (so if they know you won't be stoned to death or smth)
But yeah - we are a minority and that will not change, at least not the in nearest future. Because of that we will have problems with finding a mate/partner but it's not that we should care what society thinks about us. Everyone is different and even zoo's are not one group. We just like animals... a lot.
a) the public doesn't know
b) you live in a civilized country (so if they know you won't be stoned to death or smth)
But yeah - we are a minority and that will not change, at least not the in nearest future. Because of that we will have problems with finding a mate/partner but it's not that we should care what society thinks about us. Everyone is different and even zoo's are not one group. We just like animals... a lot.
UniqueAmerican
Tourist
Furries and bestialists are not zoophiles. As for the second point, per Troy Media: "
It took decades to fully expose the deep and systemic problems with the studies. Even if the data had been accurately collected, it still would have suffered the problem of volunteer bias.
The American Statistical Association was pressured to favourably review the Male Report, yet also expressed deep concerns: “In the case of homosexuality, we are chiefly concerned about possible bias in the sample. … Critics are justified in their objections that many of the most … provocative statements in the book are not based on the data presented therein, and it is not made clear to the reader on what evidence the statements are based.”
In addition, according to Wikipedia's citations: "The term zoosexual was proposed by Hani Miletski in 2002[4] as a value-neutral term. Usage of zoosexual as a noun (in reference to a person) is synonymous with zoophile, while the adjectival form of the word – as, for instance, in the phrase "zoosexual act" – may indicate sexual activity between a human and a non-human animal"
Per her publisher from Understanding Bestiality and Zoophilia: "Miletski is notable for her 1999 book on zoophilia, which formally established " whether a genuine orientation might exist (as opposed to a mere fetish...)
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