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When danger is ignored

Mesond

Mesond

Citizen of Zooville
BANNED USER
Let's get one thing clear first before anything else.

IGNORNACE IS A KILLER​
Martin Luther King jr has a point. Nothing is more dangerous.

Vent incoming​

The mods here haven't been ignoring the danger from what I've seen so far. Now what if I said other mods on other sites ignore sanity? They'd pretend otherwise of course.

Hell, I'd even say "people die" and other mods won't even say anything about it. What the fuck is up with people?

Lack of communication causes trauma. All it takes to address concerns is holding conversations. But do some people even try? Hell, for that matter do most people even try?

Conflict avoidance being counter productive is backed up by therapists. I'm taking that advice over hurt feelings.

The mods here seem to be able to ask questions. The one I spoke too at least. Can you imagine that I was never once asked for years on other sites? Imagine never being asked once. No questions. No answers. No feedback or trying to get my side of the story. Years that went on for.

Who else has that been done too then? I can keep my mental shit together, but that's me. Who else has been abused like that? Even killers take issue with this. If the worst of monsters take issue with something then figure it out. So can we pay attention to the danger already? Because people keep ignoring it.

It's like this. I know what cuases people trauma. You might be afraid of "hurt feelings" and "A little bit of danger". But I know what causes trauma specifically. It's certain key things. Like not asking and answering. Not admitting what you do when called out. And I assure you, avoiding the hard topics will get to you. It will break you. But if you want to ignore this topic and pretend you won't be bothered then feel free.

How can people be honest if people just go "Fuck you and it's wrong to have concerns"? It's not just an issue with one online location (Don't trust F-chat btw). It's an objective online issue. Mods just aren't trained for it. Most are too impatient and intolerant and can't even do basic straight answers. They have this unrealistic expectation of "Don't make arguments". But think about it. How can you be honest if you don't make arguments happen? Is it "wrong" to have concerns then?

Are people so ashamed that the truth has to be hidden?

People don't think in the heat of the moment. Too busy blaming. Too busy clinging to their expectations. Being close minded.

Stop for a moment and think. Very carefully. What if everything you think you know is backwards? Or a lie. How can you be so sure?

I also want to point out I lost someone to suicide online a decade ago. So I have first hand personal experience on that account. I learned from that. There are certain things I must never do. And yet I constantly see mods doing those things over and over and I know it fucks people up.

Seems to be the more "taboo" people that understand better. Less judgemental I suppose. But holy fuck, do we have to hide like this? If the less understanding mods keep getting away with what they do then we're allowing it. So I'm going to challenge it more.
 
OffgridK9lover said:
WTF are you driveling on about?
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I think it's about suicide and/or cyberbullying? I am honestly not sure as the only thing that gave me any insight about the "danger" was this here at the end: "I lost someone to suicide online a decade ago."
 
NewCaineFluf said:
I think it's about suicide and/or cyberbullying? I am honestly not sure as the only thing that gave me any insight about the "danger" was this here at the end: "I lost someone to suicide online a decade ago."
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Life is short, even shorter if weak. Reality sucks like that, but nothing in that word salad seems to point to any direction.
 
NewCaineFluf said:
I think it's about suicide and/or cyberbullying? I am honestly not sure as the only thing that gave me any insight about the "danger" was this here at the end: "I lost someone to suicide online a decade ago."
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You paid more attention then the others did then. If all people can do is make comments like "word salad" then they did not read properly.

It's not even the "bullying" that's the problem. It's the hypocrisy. Rather, the lack of accountability from cowards that pretend they can get away with shit.

I'm actually a bully myself. But it really depends on HOW you do it. "Pushing away" is just... dishonest. It just proves people are too afraid to hear anything then their own opinion.

Now if you struiggle with understanding that's fine. But if you're a coward about it then that's hypocritical. Simply put, a coward is always a hypocrite. They just might not realise it. They'll probably be too busy going "I blame you for everything". Not once looking at their own actions.

In short, in the most simple of terms, you can only work yourself up with your own assumptions. No one does it "to you". You do it to yourself.
 
Mesond said:
You paid more attention then the others did then. If all people can do is make comments like "word salad" then they did not read properly.

It's not even the "bullying" that's the problem. It's the hypocrisy. Rather, the lack of accountability from cowards that pretend they can get away with shit.

I'm actually a bully myself. But it really depends on HOW you do it. "Pushing away" is just... dishonest. It just proves people are too afraid to hear anything then their own opinion.

Now if you struiggle with understanding that's fine. But if you're a coward about it then that's hypocritical. Simply put, a coward is always a hypocrite. They just might not realise it. They'll probably be too busy going "I blame you for everything". Not once looking at their own actions.

In short, in the most simple of terms, you can only work yourself up with your own assumptions. No one does it "to you". You do it to yourself.
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No, you just did not make it very clear on what you talking about. I did read your post twice, and still don't know what you are talking about, or what the mods have to do with anything.
 
Mesond said:
The mods here haven't been ignoring the danger from what I've seen so far.
Hell, I'd even say "people die" and other mods won't even say anything about it. What the fuck is up with people?
Lack of communication causes trauma. All it takes to address concerns is holding conversations. But do some people even try?
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Can you please point out examples of what you have a problem with? Threads, posts, concrete cases where what you are talking about happened?

This is a discussion forum, the whole website is about communication. If some thread does not have answers from mods it is because it either has been answered by someone else, it is answered in a different thread or is just is so simple that it does not need an answer or that particular mod does not know the answer, or the thread is not a question for a mod and anyone can answer it...

Instead of walking around the issue, please post actual instances. Thanks.
 
Mesond said:
You paid more attention then the others did then. If all people can do is make comments like "word salad" then they did not read properly.

It's not even the "bullying" that's the problem. It's the hypocrisy. Rather, the lack of accountability from cowards that pretend they can get away with shit.

I'm actually a bully myself. But it really depends on HOW you do it. "Pushing away" is just... dishonest. It just proves people are too afraid to hear anything then their own opinion.

Now if you struiggle with understanding that's fine. But if you're a coward about it then that's hypocritical. Simply put, a coward is always a hypocrite. They just might not realise it. They'll probably be too busy going "I blame you for everything". Not once looking at their own actions.

In short, in the most simple of terms, you can only work yourself up with your own assumptions. No one does it "to you". You do it to yourself.
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Hmmm talking on accountability and seems most agree, if you wanted to communicate you failed by making word salad, Now lets not be a hypocrite and own it.

If you wish to be serious then it is not the time to use fruity language.
 
Here's some advice for my "word salad" for people that struggle to keep up. Read a paragraph at a time. If responding to something in a paragraph quote and reply. This way I'll know where people get confused. I'll be mostly responding to pes directly.
pes said:
Can you please point out examples of what you have a problem with? Threads, posts, concrete cases where what you are talking about happened?

This is a discussion forum, the whole website is about communication. If some thread does not have answers from mods it is because it either has been answered by someone else, it is answered in a different thread or is just is so simple that it does not need an answer or that particular mod does not know the answer, or the thread is not a question for a mod and anyone can answer it...

Instead of walking around the issue, please post actual instances. Thanks.
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I've been online for a decade and there's many online circles. On that note did you know discord has roleplay feral servers? Beastliaty is an option in some of them. This is an example of how things "actually" work. As opposed to how other mods "want/expect" things to work.

In other words the problem is expectations. Those "dishonest assumptions". That people think are "the right way". Which are then turned into "rules". What if it's all one big lie?

Most mods want/expect things to be a certain way. Clinging to their "rules" and "obligations". Using "should" logic. Using very bad wording that goes against "choice". Try to correct people that fragile though and it's a "personal attack". Users I can get results with even after disagreements. But try doing it to an insecure mod.

Mods tend to develop a "hive mind". I even talked to someone on Second Life that used to be a mod who said exactly that. So this just confirms it. Hell, at this point even mods agree with me.

Sites on a whole don't invite the harder conversations. Maybe discord. Tends to have vent rooms. A place for people to just talk about whatever it is they need to talk about. Helps prevent "spill over". Older sites aren't even thinking about it because they're too stuck in their comfort zone.

If there's just a place for people to "unload" (like discord vent servers) then people can speak their mind without the "trapped thoughts". Otherwise it just spills over into other topics. People need a place for it. That goes double in chat rooms. If people don't argue, if they can't be flawed then they're having to be "perfect". And I know what that does to people. So I'm very concerned for online on a whole. This site might have a better understanding, but think about other sites.

I want to point out I've been online for a decade and have been there for people that suffer from trauma. Online. I talk to people that self harm and are suicidal. I deal with situations mods aren't trained for. It's not "my job" either. But is that an excuse to ignore it? Instant chat and forum messages will go better of course. But there's not enough "social awareness" about this kind of thing. And mods, on a whole, are not trained enough for it. They'd even admit that themselves.

Just try to listen to people when they're at their worst I suppose.
 
It is not letting me quote individual selections because the software is more and more broken. (But that is a rant for another thread.)
So.

Yes I know discord has feral bestiality servers. On an unrelated note Discord itself is probably the poorest choice for illegal content because of the way the company handles it.

I do admit that I have a fair difficulty understanding what you are talking about and assigning that to real life cases.
That is both because English is not my primary language and because your text is difficult to parse for me. So I will respond to whatever I do understand and leave the rest alone.

The hive mind argument stems from the fact that all mods have to enforce the same set of rules. Therefore they logically have to have the same or very similar set of values.

The place where you can almost without restrictions unload here is the Dumpster fire section.
On top discussion in non-dumpster fire threads is fairly open, you can do almost anything there as long as it is somewhat related to the topic of the thread and sometimes even not related to the thread.
You would be surprised how many reports we get of people not liking what we do allow to be said in threads because they personally see it as bullying and such. While I and other mods see it as an expression of an opinion that unfortunately is not the same as your opinion.
The usual: "This is an open public forum where you will get responses that are not going to be praise only."

What I get from your reply is that a lot of the problems you have exist on other sites and maybe/not here.
Can you explain how the problems you see apply specifically to zooville?

"But is that an excuse to ignore it?"
From my experience it is not being ignored. But at the same time nobody here is qualified to give professional advice, so logically there will be a wide variety of responses and not all of them will be terrific.
A few examples (to get more do the search) of other users and mods reacting to people in psychological distress:
Search results for query: shame

Dealing with shame

Hey. I created this account a few years ago but haven’t been on because of shame and fear of being found out. Tonight I couldn’t take it anymore and came on here. As the name implies I love horses both mares and stallions. I’ve never done anything irl. I’m at a very low point and wanted to hear...
www.zoovilleforum.net www.zoovilleforum.net

Search results for query: guilt
https://www.zoovilleforum.net/threads/struggling-with-guilt.90648/

dealing with depression and loneliness

so for the past eight years I’ve had significant depression and on and off again suicidal ideation (where someone fantasizes about suicide but doesn’t really plan to harm themselves). It got to the point where I pulled away from friend groups and no longer speak to most people I used to hang...
www.zoovilleforum.net www.zoovilleforum.net
 
It is not letting me quote individual selections because the software is more and more broken. (But that is a rant for another thread.)
So.
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I'm copying and pasting what you said and am using the quote function (the double tears). See if that works.

Yes I know discord has feral bestiality servers. On an unrelated note Discord itself is probably the poorest choice for illegal content because of the way the company handles it.
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It could be by design. "Let the people sort it out." It's when things are too "by the book" that people protest and riot more. Hell, just look at the real world. It's all over.

That is both because English is not my primary language
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Ahhhh. In some ways you make a good example though. Other mods would go "I'm on a high horse". But you can say when you don't understand. That's all I want from people sometimes.

The hive mind argument stems from the fact that all mods have to enforce the same set of rules. Therefore they logically have to have the same or very similar set of values.
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Yes. This would be "blind agreements". People make "Snap judgements" then report quickly. Mods only get one side of the story and then only seek to cast blame on someone. When not having the other side of the story. It makes things very unpleasant for people.

The place where you can almost without restrictions unload here is the Dumpster fire section.
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Hmm. So that can be for the "serious" talks as well as the "shit posting"? I didn't think of that.

While I and other mods see it as an expression of an opinion that unfortunately is not the same as your opinion.
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This is exactly my point. Everyone has an opinion. But most people just want "What agrees with theirs alone". It's the closed mind that does people in.

Can you explain how the problems you see apply specifically to zooville?
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One site affects another. Let's say some mods pretend it's just about their own site alone. What they fail to understand is that people from a site go to other sites. People talk to people. Which then circles back on the first site. None of that would happen if people just listened to each other the first time.

Example: F-chat affects discord which then circles back on F-chat. Or, to use my past example, Furcadia affects Skype which affects Furcadia. Lack of communication is a killer. That taught me to always pay attention. You don't see what happens behind monitors.

From my experience it is not being ignored. But at the same time nobody here is qualified to give professional advice, so logically there will be a wide variety of responses and not all of them will be terrific.
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I can garuntee that other mods on other sites will claim to care about sanity and danger yet ignore it. They might have good intentions but that's the problem. A site like Fetlife will have groups, but on a whole it knows better then to ignore any danger. If you say "Danger" on Fetlife they'll have to take note even if disagreeing.

Sites that enforce "Don't ignore danger" will go better. Hi, I'm danger.

Search results for query: shame
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There's also pride. Mods try to employ censorship. The way I see it censorship is the problem. This causes people to suffer in silence. It's like going "It's wrong to have an opinion". Every opinion matters as far as I'm concerned. The best communities will invite it. But look around. Who actually does that?

You can hurt someone. You can destroy someones life while being there for them. You can break someone down to the point they are nothing (legit). And still gain their loyalty. But if you do THAT then you lost it. There's a damn good reason I'll never block or push away. I'd sooner die.
 
troublesomeraptor said:
One way of help others understand you is to write shorter, clearer posts.
Try using this post as a model: it's short, so you were probably able to parse it easily.
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Also don't use a buzzfed style shock attention grabber title that doesn't pertain to what you're actually trying to convey.
 
Then perhaps you people can explain to me why the mods themselves on other sites wrote long walls at me.

Look. It's not as easy as "just write short". Can that help? Sure. But if there's a lot of information to convey then it can be easier said then done.

It also doesn't help that when I was asking short single questions it was just ignored. It's like people are afraid of being proven wrong.
 
Last edited:
You guys gave me an idea for a game actually. Here you go.

Questions and answers

People often try to "explain" an answer before answering a question. The problem isn't people can say a lot. It's that people often "jump ahead" and skip a straight answer. How the game works Someone asks a question. Someone else answers the question. Asking another question back counts. After...
www.zoovilleforum.net www.zoovilleforum.net
 
Mesond said:
Then perhaps you people can explain to me why the mods themselves on other sites wrote long walls at me.

Look. It's not as easy as "just write short". Can that help? Sure. But if there's a lot of information to convey then it can be easier said then done.

It also doesn't help that when I was asking short single questions it was just ignored. It's like people are afraid of being proven wrong.
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I hear ya', bud. When you're passionate about some idea, it's tempting to spill each and every detail of the thing.

But hey, getting to the point quickly really makes it clear what you're asking; hence, you'll receive more useful responses, assuming people are responding in good faith. To that end, I'm not sure how any of us would know what's going on at other forums. Sorry you had a rough time wherever it was.
 
assuming
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Key word here.

People often assume and cling to expectations. Refusing to consider anything then their own opinion. That's basically what happened.

Who tries to consider your viewpoint?
 
Mesond said:
Key word here.

People often assume and cling to expectations. Refusing to consider anything then their own opinion. That's basically what happened.

Who tries to consider your viewpoint?
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I said "assuming people are responding in good faith". That phrase doesn't have much to do with the idea of 'making assumptions'; instead, someone 'responds in good faith' by making an honest attempt to understand the other party.

If the people you're trying to socialize with aren't participating in good faith, then I also wouldn't see any reason to continue.

Of course, similarly, you can't expect people to entertain a soapboxer, either. Socialising is give and take.
 
troublesomeraptor said:
I said "assuming people are responding in good faith". That phrase doesn't have much to do with the idea of 'making assumptions'; instead, someone 'responds in good faith' by making an honest attempt to understand the other party.

If the people you're trying to socialize with aren't participating in good faith, then I also wouldn't see any reason to continue.

Of course, similarly, you can't expect people to entertain a soapboxer, either. Socialising is give and take.
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When people abuse power (picture cops, mods, politicians. etc) then there's every reason to continue. Otherwise they just keep getting away with it don't they? It's only when people fight back that things change.

Let's take Helldivers 2 for example. Mods abuse power there. The people were so fed up they spammed discord with F repeatedly. The mods had to back down. But it only happened after people fought back.

Same goes for real life in history. Only when people make a stand does change happen. WE have the power. When we unite against those that abuse it. It's how taxes got lowered in the UK. In the past that is. Can't comment on the U.S.

If you don't fight back against abuse then you allow it. The only language people like that will ever understand is "making a stand".
 
Mesond said:
When people abuse power (picture cops, mods, politicians. etc) then there's every reason to continue. Otherwise they just keep getting away with it don't they? It's only when people fight back that things change.

Let's take Helldivers 2 for example. Mods abuse power there. The people were so fed up they spammed discord with F repeatedly. The mods had to back down. But it only happened after people fought back.

Same goes for real life in history. Only when people make a stand does change happen. WE have the power. When we unite against those that abuse it. It's how taxes got lowered in the UK. In the past that is. Can't comment on the U.S.

If you don't fight back against abuse then you allow it. The only language people like that will ever understand is "making a stand".
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I see! I think I've finally understood the meaning of this thread now that you explain it like this. Thanks!

Political activism, and involving yourself in injustices for the better, are both hugely respectable traits.
Personally, I find that many rallying cries like this tend to get stuck in firing people up -- doing the easy work of getting people aware of an issue is a great first step. However, that kind of "fighting" is all talk, and the easy answer of violence doesn't work to fix broken systems.

After all, even if you break an existing system, all the hard work of systemic reform and creating new rules for a society takes slow, dedicated work to accumulate the consent of other people and the power to make changes.

In all of that difficulty, I don't resent other people for seeking a more-peaceful lifestyle and just trying to get by.
For example, games are a form of escapism; they're comforting retreats from hard reality, so I can see why people get mad at developers who make un-fun choices, but they're just doing their best to provide some kind of relief from the weight of the world to their players.
 
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