I wonder...
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btwiamazoophile
Zooville Settler
I haven't butchered as a profession, but it is something I've done to prepare food for myself and other animals. If a person eats meat, they should understand what that means.
If I were attracted to bovines or other farm animals, it probably wouldn't be something I'd be able to stomach. Even as just a dog lover, turning what was once a living being into just a portioned commodity is kind of dark. But it's also extremely "normal" and it happens literally all the time and most people support this infrastructure.
I do think it would be more morally consistent to be vegetarian or vegan. I have been before, but am not currently for various reasons.
nekdoneco123
Esteemed Citizen of ZV
i think i kinda "get" what you're getting at. and i do believe most "higher animals" have feelings and wants and should be held in as high or equal regard as us and being bred to be food probably isn't it, but it is what it is. we need meat to survive. i'm all up for some sort of lab grown meat that doesn't require unnecessary suffering and we're sadly pretty far of that so until then i will continue eating it and best i can do is not buy mass produced kind... and eat fish.
animals i fancy (dogs) are carnivorous, so the "zoophile shouldn't eat animals they love" angle doesn't really fly with me.
animals i fancy (dogs) are carnivorous, so the "zoophile shouldn't eat animals they love" angle doesn't really fly with me.
amorousdog5
Citizen of Zooville
False. As proven by the many vegetarians and vegans in existence currently, meat is optional for humans.
Doesn't mean I want to go without it. I'm a meat-eater, but for that very reason I don't think I could ever get intimate with a cow. "Hey baby. I just got finished butchering and eating your cousin. Let's get sloppy!"
...yeah, that's messed up. Way too much cognitive dissonance. So for me, cows are for eating rather than loving.
nekdoneco123
Esteemed Citizen of ZV
proven how? by sickly looking people with a misplaced superiority complex who need so many supplements (some being derived from animals anyway, even "plant-based" creatine still contains bovine gelatin when in capsule form) in addition to their "better diet" to properly function it makes junkie's mouth water?
show me one vegan who also uses their muscles for a living.
btwiamazoophile
Zooville Settler
There are a number of vegan body builders. It is a fact that a person can certainly be healthy, athletic, and vegan all at the same time. It's not that many supplements that are needed.
Feel free to justify eating meat any other way, but it's not because you will die without it.
amorousdog5
Citizen of Zooville
Your description of vegetarians sounds like a cliche stereotype scraped out of internet chat rooms. Have you never actually met one in person?
As far as supplements go, you are right that creatine supplements typically contain bovine gelatin WHEN IN CAPSULE FORM. Simple solution for a vegan, don't get it in capsule form. Creatine itself is synthesized through a chemical process that does not involve animal products.
Chicago Bears quarterback Justin Fields is vegan, and even a quick google will show you that many other bodybuilders and athletes are as well.
nekdoneco123
Esteemed Citizen of ZV
not really a me problem when most of them act like that. "me as a vegan,..." memes didn't come out of thin air.
i did and she was the stereotypical "i will yell meat is murder anytime you mention anything". dunno if it's a vegan thing or her, but she also didn't like any honey "because it's bee slavery". i broke all contact when she started losing finger nails.
the various kinds of vegan threads "we" got here over the years were plenty for me in terms of additional vegan exposure.
btwiamazoophile
Zooville Settler
You say all of this, but you also asserted that humans can't survive without meat which is simply not true regardless of your personal hangups with vegans. There's a wealth of information that supports this reality.
Just like a zoo can have sex with animals without being a rapist, a vegan can be a vegan without being psychotic. A vegetarian can be a vegetarian without being psychotic. Being conscious of what you're eating and why is good for you.
nekdoneco123
Esteemed Citizen of ZV
i asserted correctly and i like how you fail to see the irony twice now.. humans can't survive without meat. you wouldn't need the supplements otherwise, if you just could live off of quinoa. are there workarounds? sure. doesn't really change the basic assertion of "humans can't survive without meat" being correct.
almost as odd belief as calling any diet that needs to be also fueled by any amounts of pills, powders and capsules "healthy".
amorousdog5
Citizen of Zooville
I notice you failed to comment on the fact that I provided examples of "vegans who also uses their muscles for a living". There are many in fact... no way to backpeddle out of that one, so best just to ignore it, eh? As for the one vegan you've met, assuming you're not just telling stories (few people are so utterly oblivious to their health needs that they'd actually reach the point of losing fingernails, but whatever) then you're basing your judgement of an entire category of people based on one bad experience. That's damn ignorant.
So basically by your own admission, humans can survive without meat if they take supplements. Which makes the statement "humans can't survive without meat" FALSE. You could try the statement, "humans can't survive without meat unless they take supplements", but guess what? Also FALSE. That would be forgetting about the vegetarians who are happy to have eggs and dairy in their diet, which can supply creatine and B12. Stubbornly keep insisting on your own special version of english if you want, but I think it's pretty clear you're full of shit.
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Rocthorne
Citizen of Zooville
You do know gladiators were primarily vegan right?
mxdwxnders
Zooville Settler
I mean as long as you don't get turned on by the meat... I guess it's okay
TropicalCritter
Zooville Settler
That will depend on the mentality of each individual, their culture, and their context in general.
AuzShepherd
Tourist
Am I okay with it - yes, absolutely. I understand that in order for me to be able to eat meat that living things have to die.
Could I do it - no, absolutely not. I couldn't take the life of an animal willingly unless it was life or death situation.
Could I do it - no, absolutely not. I couldn't take the life of an animal willingly unless it was life or death situation.
btwiamazoophile
Zooville Settler
For the record, butchering only refers to preparing the carcass. I have never hunted an animal but I have fished. I did step on a frog once on accident, too.
nekdoneco123
Esteemed Citizen of ZV
just doing my best to avoid needless "what constitutes using muscles for a living?" argument. should've guessed what "livings" you'd go for, that's on me. i do manual labor for a living and there are days i come home so beat i don't think a bowl of soy might help with the muscle fatigue.
i mean, to hold a general dislike for a certain kind of diet on a made up story just to have a story would be kinda stupid, wouldn't it? i honestly don't know how you get to the point of losing your finger nails and not think about changing literally anything about your lifestyle.
okay i admit it. i was WRONG, you were RIGHT (was the caps really necessary?). next time i'll go with "humans can't survive without animal products". my view of vegans is too skewed to be "fixed". or maybe i'll just write my piece and move on as usual, it's not like i was pushing my views on anyone.
you do know that bbc article was debunked in 2021 right? they ate fish and seafood along with other "peasant foods" of their time, just in lesser amounts (likely to make keeping them cheaper, since you know they were mostly slaves) which is why less thorough bone screening came out with whatever it came out with for the original "gladiators were vegan" myth to begin.
besides, what does it have to do with anything?
ukbbwbbm
Tourist
but a bull is ok, yeh?
btwiamazoophile
Zooville Settler
I'm not a farmer but that's an odd way to phrase it lol
amorousdog5
Citizen of Zooville
There are obvious reasons for a farmer to be kind to their livestock up until they slaughter them, both to make things easier on the farmer and to make life better for the animals. Assuming the animals were willing participants, sex could be seen as an extension of that, and nothing morally wrong with it therefore.
Even so... the kind of cold-blooded pragmatism that would be required to love an animal one day and slaughter them the next is a mindset I hope never to approach.
AuzShepherd
Tourist
Oh, right. Sorry I kind of started reading the posts and the translation got lost a little. Well, no I couldn't do the butchering part either
Coz how can someone kill an animal if it loves them?
dartel
Prized Citizen of ZV
So you're saying no murderer has ever loved any other human? Just because someone loves one of a species or even one species, doesn't mean they love every member of the species or every species.
Lobo
Tourist
Its a bit more nuance then that. I like meat but if i raise the animal i can't kill it. Unless it's a homesteading situation. I love horses but if someone offered me a horse burger, ill eat it. But I'm not killing my horse for meat. Hunting is different story though.
Cliff_W_Lab
Zooville Settler
I say it depends on the person. I hunted and fish and have butchered deer, raddits, birds, and fish. But I would have to be starving to kill and butcher a dog.